Generation of VP ?? [LSJ]

Reyda wrote: > > Hi ! > i've just another question. > > Is Life boon cumulative ? what happens if i put 2 life boons on my prey ? I > take 2 vps from his first ousting, or one then one ? > What if a methuselah has been life booned 2 times by two different > methuselahs ? does he offers 1 vp to each one when ousting his first prey ? > (thus artificially creating a VP from nowhere) or is the 1 VP for the first > booning meth , then once he kills his other prey, 1 VP to the second booning > meth ? Life Boon - Master: Out-of-Turn * If a player is saved more than once by Life Boon, the various Boons reserve a series of victory points (and ante), rather than competing with each other for a single victory point and ante. [RTR 19951017] > What happens if i life boon my prey and grandprey, then kills everyone > except me with an Ancillae emp, > do i get 1 VP for ousting my prey, 1 VP because my prey's prey is ousted, > then 1 VP for my prey's pre'ys prey, and 1 for last man standing ? Yes. You get a VP for your prey. You get the VP your prey gets for her prey (your grandprey) You get the VP your grandprey gets for her prey (your great-grandprey). You get a VP for last man standing. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

Hi ! i've just another question. Is Life boon cumulative ? what happens if i put 2 life boons on my prey ? I take 2 vps from his first ousting, or one then one ? What if a methuselah has been life booned 2 times by two different methuselahs ? does he offers 1 vp to each one when ousting his first prey ? (thus artificially creating a VP from nowhere) or is the 1 VP for the first booning meth , then once he kills his other prey, 1 VP to the second booning meth ? What happens if i life boon my prey and grandprey, then kills everyone except me with an Ancillae emp, do i get 1 VP for ousting my prey, 1 VP because my prey's prey is ousted, then 1 VP for my prey's pre'ys prey, and 1 for last man standing ? reyda

LSJ wrote: > > Reyda wrote: > > > > Hi ! > > i've just another question. > > > > Is Life boon cumulative ? what happens if i put 2 life boons on my prey ? I > > take 2 vps from his first ousting, or one then one ? > > What if a methuselah has been life booned 2 times by two different > > methuselahs ? does he offers 1 vp to each one when ousting his first prey ? > > (thus artificially creating a VP from nowhere) or is the 1 VP for the first > > booning meth , then once he kills his other prey, 1 VP to the second booning > > meth ? > > Life Boon - Master: Out-of-Turn > * If a player is saved more than once by Life Boon, the various Boons > reserve a series of victory points (and ante), rather than competing with > each other for a single victory point and ante. [RTR 19951017] What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? Which meth gets the first VP? Is it merely an effect of whoever is fastest and gets it out of their hands first? Or can as many meths as legal play them once someone is ousted? And then how do you determine who gets the VP, since I was under the assumption that many effects are simultaneous. Since at no other time in V:TES does quickness of playing a card make a factor, I hope that also does not apply here. Thanks, Chris -- chris shorb <www.vtesinla.org> (A V:TES site in development) prince of torrance, california Ultimate Disc - Hockey - Vampire the Eternal Struggle Ebay page <http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/vtessingles/>

<snip> >Since at no other time in V:TES does quickness of playing > a card make a factor, I hope that also does not apply here. I thought that was the case when two Meths wanted to block the same action with Eagle's Sight?

In message <3B6A31F9...@vtesinla.org>, Chris Shorb <chr...@vtesinla.org> writes >What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? You can't be. One person will have to play their life boon before the other. This usually goes "acting Methuselah, defending Methuselah, clockwise round the table from acting Methuselah". -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D EBD690ECD7A1F HEY, MOM! I FOUND SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE ON THE INTERNET B457CA213D7E6 YOU WERE TELLING ME TO NOT TALK TO! 68C3695D623D5D

> What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? This cannot happen as the first life boon prevents the second from being played. Which > meth gets the first VP? I believer that it goes clockwise from the ousted player. Is it merely an effect of whoever is fastest > and gets it out of their hands first? Or can as many meths as legal > play them once someone is ousted? And then how do you determine who > gets the VP, since I was under the assumption that many effects are > simultaneous. Since at no other time in V:TES does quickness of playing > a card make a factor, I hope that also does not apply here. VP's I believe are distributed in the order of the Life Boons. The First Life Boon gets the first VP. Comments Welcome. Norman S. Brown, Jr. XZealot Archon of the Swamp

"Chris Shorb" <chr...@vtesinla.org> wrote in message news:3B6A31F9...@vtesinla.org... [ quoted text not captured ] Can't happen. The first Life Boon must save him (card text), so the second cannot be played. For rules one which is first, see the rulebook [1.6.1.6] [ quoted text not captured ]

LSJ wrote: [snip earlier discussions] > > > > > What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? Which > > meth gets the first VP? [more snip - you didn't miss much] > Can't happen. The first Life Boon must save him (card text), so the second > cannot be played. > For rules one which is first, see the rulebook [1.6.1.6] > 1.6.1.6: Sequencing: If two or more players want to play a card or effect, the acting Methuselah plays first. At every stage, the acting player always has the opportunity to play the next card or effect. So after playing one effect, she may play another and another. Once she is finished, the opportunity passes to the defending Methuselah (in the cases of directed actions and combat), then to the rest of the Methuselahs in clockwise order from the acting Methuselah. Note that if any card or effect is used by any Methuselah, the acting Methuselah again gets the opportunity to play the next effect. So if a bleed against prey A is declared, Meth A deflects to B, B is ousted. Player A gets to play life boon first correct? Since they are to the right of the original Meth. As soon as the deflection is played, the deflection's target Meth becomes the new "defending Methuselah", right? Just to be clear. [ quoted text not captured ]

Chris Shorb wrote: > LSJ wrote: > > > What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? Which > > > meth gets the first VP? > > > Can't happen. The first Life Boon must save him (card text), so the second > > cannot be played. > > For rules one which is first, see the rulebook [1.6.1.6] > > > > 1.6.1.6: Sequencing: If two or more players want to play a card or > effect, the acting Methuselah plays first. At every stage, the acting > player always has the opportunity to play the next card or effect. So > after playing one effect, she may play another and another. Once she is > finished, the opportunity passes to the defending Methuselah (in the > cases of directed actions and combat), then to the rest of the > Methuselahs in clockwise order from the acting Methuselah. Note that if > any card or effect is used by any Methuselah, the acting Methuselah > again gets the opportunity to play the next effect. > > So if a bleed against prey A is declared, Meth A deflects to B, B is > ousted. Player A gets to play life boon first correct? Since they are > to the right of the original Meth. As soon as the deflection is played, > the deflection's target Meth becomes the new "defending Methuselah", > right? Yes. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Sun, 05 Aug 2001 16:41:59 -0700, Chris Shorb <chr...@vtesinla.org> wrote: >> > >> > What happens if they are saved by 2 life boons at the same time? Which >> > meth gets the first VP? > > On the subject of Life Boons, I wish to clarify the snatching of that VP for saving the meth. It says you get the meth's 'first vp'. Does this mean that if you save a meth that has already earned a vp, you get that vp? Or must that 'first vp' be the first one he earns after you saved him? I think it can be read either way, but I'd like an official ruling. T

In message <3b70557c.126386509@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes [Life Boon] >It says you get the meth's 'first vp'. Does this mean that if you >save a meth that has already earned a vp, you get that vp? IIRC, the use of present tense ("wins") means that it must collect future VPs, rather than snatching previously gained ones. <URL:http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=206ba6b96b8c5ba,9 2&start=40> (About half way down, it's a section of a thread, sorry.) "No, Life Boon reserves the "first" VP that the Methuselah "wins", not one that he has already won. Here "first" means "next". (Lovely language, English, eh?)" [LSJ 20000207] [ quoted text not captured ]

On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 04:14:39 +0100, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: > ><URL:http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=206ba6b96b8c5ba,9 >2&start=40> (About half way down, it's a section of a thread, sorry.) > >"No, Life Boon reserves the "first" VP that the Methuselah "wins", not >one that he has already won. Here "first" means "next". (Lovely >language, English, eh?)" [LSJ 20000207] The url was um...not that helpful when it consists of 9 different pages of material to sift through. I appreciate the thought though. As to the ruling, it is curious that this does NOT show up in the latest C,R and Erratta..... LSJ??????? T

On Tue, 07 Aug 2001 10:36:47 -0400, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: >Talo...@hotmail.com wrote: >> >> On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 04:14:39 +0100, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> >> wrote: >> >> > >> ><URL:http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=206ba6b96b8c5ba,9 >> >2&start=40> (About half way down, it's a section of a thread, sorry.) >> > >> >"No, Life Boon reserves the "first" VP that the Methuselah "wins", not >> >one that he has already won. Here "first" means "next". (Lovely >> >language, English, eh?)" [LSJ 20000207] >> >> The url was um...not that helpful when it consists of 9 different >> pages of material to sift through. I appreciate the thought though. >> >> As to the ruling, it is curious that this does NOT show up in the >> latest C,R and Erratta..... >> >> LSJ??????? > >Yes? > Looking for confirmation of that ruling. Also wondering why it isnt in the latest E R & C? T

[ quoted text not captured ] Oh. I thought the cited and quoted message was sufficient. Confirmed. > Also wondering why it isnt in the latest E R & C? No need. Life Boons reserve a series of VPs, as stated in the ERC. [ quoted text not captured ]

In message <3b728421.138328839@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >><URL:http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=206ba6b96b8c5ba,9 >>2&start=40> (About half way down, it's a section of a thread, sorry.) >> >>"No, Life Boon reserves the "first" VP that the Methuselah "wins", not >>one that he has already won. Here "first" means "next". (Lovely >>language, English, eh?)" [LSJ 20000207] > >The url was um...not that helpful when it consists of 9 different >pages of material to sift through. I appreciate the thought though. The specific quote I took is on the page cited (about half-way down, in a post from LSJ). Search for the word "language" or something and you'll see. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Tue, 07 Aug 2001 12:31:49 -0400, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: > >> Also wondering why it isnt in the latest E R & C? > >No need. > >Life Boons reserve a series of VPs, as stated in the ERC. > There is a need. The 'series of VPs' could begin at the first VP ever won by that saved meth, or at the next'first' vp, as it appears to be with the quoted ruling that is not shown in the ER&C. And trust me, someone will argue the former at some point. I would have until last night when I began thinking over the verious defenitions of how the card could be played. T

On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 16:28:37 +0100, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: >In message <3b728421.138328839@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >>><URL:http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&safe=off&th=206ba6b96b8c5ba,9 >>>2&start=40> (About half way down, it's a section of a thread, sorry.) >>> >>>"No, Life Boon reserves the "first" VP that the Methuselah "wins", not >>>one that he has already won. Here "first" means "next". (Lovely >>>language, English, eh?)" [LSJ 20000207] >> >>The url was um...not that helpful when it consists of 9 different >>pages of material to sift through. I appreciate the thought though. > >The specific quote I took is on the page cited (about half-way down, in >a post from LSJ). Search for the word "language" or something and >you'll see. > It was? I was very tired then....thanks. T

Talo...@hotmail.com wrote: > The 'series of VPs' could begin at the first VP ever won by that saved > meth, or at the next'first' vp, as it appears to be with the quoted > ruling that is not shown in the ER&C. I have yet to meet anyone that actually believes that a Life Boon will retroactively take VPs. The question usually comes up after discussing some other point and someone attempts to extend the verbage beyond what it reads. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Tue, 07 Aug 2001 14:56:14 -0400, LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote: >Talo...@hotmail.com wrote: >> The 'series of VPs' could begin at the first VP ever won by that saved >> meth, or at the next'first' vp, as it appears to be with the quoted >> ruling that is not shown in the ER&C. > >I have yet to meet anyone that actually believes that a Life Boon will >retroactively take VPs. The question usually comes up after discussing >some other point and someone attempts to extend the verbage beyond >what it reads. > > Congratulations, you have met one. I used LB in exactly that manner this weekend at a tourney, and had no problem convincing everyone there that I could. I hadn't used it that way before until the opportunity arose, based on the somewhat ambiguous wording. It was after the games that I pondered again and decided to post here, as I felt it was in error. In fact it was only the 'henceforth' that gave me pause at that point, because otherwise grabbing the first vp is not a problem. Had the quoted ruling been in ER&C in the first place, I wouldnt need to. Is it so much to ask that it be put into it now? T

In message <3b715ed7.194327277@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >Had the quoted ruling been in ER&C in the first place, I wouldnt need >to. Is it so much to ask that it be put into it now? Were every post from LSJ in the ER&C, they would require a small rainforest to print out. [ quoted text not captured ]

On Tue, 7 Aug 2001 22:44:14 +0100, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: >In message <3b715ed7.194327277@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >>Had the quoted ruling been in ER&C in the first place, I wouldnt need >>to. Is it so much to ask that it be put into it now? > >Were every post from LSJ in the ER&C, they would require a small >rainforest to print out. > Im not talking about every post. I am talking about rulings. T

In message <3b72de7d.80164095@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >>>Had the quoted ruling been in ER&C in the first place, I wouldnt need >>>to. Is it so much to ask that it be put into it now? >> >>Were every post from LSJ in the ER&C, they would require a small >>rainforest to print out. > >Im not talking about every post. > >I am talking about rulings. There are, quite literally, *thousands* of "rulings" which come from LSJ's posts. -- James Coupe PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D EBD690ECD7A1F You scumbag, you maggot, you cheap lousy faggot B457CA213D7E6 Happy Christmas your arse, I pray God it's our last 68C3695D623D5D

On Thu, 9 Aug 2001 20:13:40 +0100, James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote: >In message <3b72de7d.80164095@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >>>>Had the quoted ruling been in ER&C in the first place, I wouldnt need >>>>to. Is it so much to ask that it be put into it now? >>> >>>Were every post from LSJ in the ER&C, they would require a small >>>rainforest to print out. >> >>Im not talking about every post. >> >>I am talking about rulings. > >There are, quite literally, *thousands* of "rulings" which come from >LSJ's posts. > Yeah I guess I wasn't thinking of it that way. I presume there is some selection method by which these rulings are put into the CR&E then? Out of curiosity, how did you find that ruling on LB/first vp seeing as it wasnt in the ER&C? T

In message <3b74df41.75361752@news>, Talo...@hotmail.com writes >Out of curiosity, how did you find that ruling on LB/first vp seeing >as it wasnt in the ER&C? 1) I knew it existed anyway. (This is a major help.) 2) I can follow the logic of the rulings. (This is also a major help.) 3) groups.google.com/advanced_group_search [ quoted text not captured ]