So currently the 4 main independant clans have the following numbers
in vampires:
Group 2/3/4/5
Assamites: 26 / 2 / 10 / 1
Followers: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0
Giovanni: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0
Ravnos: 24 / 2 / 11 / 0
Assamites group 2 are +2 due to
Tariq advanced and Tegerius. Followers
are +1 in group 2 due to Kemintri
and Gios are at +1 due to Ambrogino.
This next set has 50+ new vampires, and from the checklist
so far it appears that all are either Rav/Ass/Fol/Gio.
I guess the starter only vampires are not included in the
50 new vampires mentioned for boosters so there is probably
62? new vampires. If we knock 2 off for oddities like new advanced
vampires or something for group 3 or something we are left with
15 vampires per clan.
We know that the four previewed vampires are half group 4,
half group 5.
It is unlikely that anything other than advanced vampires
will be added to group 3 as group 2 is too huge to permit
adding to gr 2/3.
Are we going to see group 4 brought up to 15 vampires per clan
like 3rd edition did for the sabbat clans? Can we expect 10/15/10/15
in the future and group 5 will be the larger of the two?
And how many expansions down the road are we away from
the camarilla clans getting rounded out in group 4 (1 prince!
in all group 4 for the cams right now).
What do we want to see grouping wise?
John P.
Winnipeg
John P. wrote:
> I guess the starter only vampires are not included in the
> 50 new vampires mentioned for boosters so there is probably
> 62? new vampires. If we knock 2 off for oddities like new advanced
> vampires or something for group 3 or something we are left with
> 15 vampires per clan.
50 new uncommons.
The library list so far includes a few uncommons.
On Sep 13, 2:13 pm, "John P." <jtpat...@mts.net> wrote:
> This next set has 50+ new vampires, and from the checklist
> so far it appears that all are either Rav/Ass/Fol/Gio.> I guess the starter only vampires are not included in the
> 50 new vampires mentioned for boosters so there is probably
> 62? new vampires. If we knock 2 off for oddities like new advanced
> vampires or something for group 3 or something we are left with
> 15 vampires per clan.
There weren't 50 new vampires mentioned for boosters.
There are 50 rares, 50 uncommons, and 50 commons.
Historically when vampires are not listed separately, the uncommon
sheet is mixed with uncommon library cards and uncommon vampires.
We could have 10 new common vampires, or 10 new rare vampires.
or both.
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/index.php?line=Checklist_LordsOfTheNight
Each booster pack contains 11 cards randomly selected from a set of
150 all-new cards (no reprints) consisting of 50 rares, 50 uncommons,
and 50 commons.
There could be anywhere from 2-12 new vampires in the starters.
Depends on how superstar the vampires are and how many reprints are
appropriate.
> What do we want to see grouping wise?
The largest possible number of G4, as far as I'm concerned. I'd (I'll ?) be
quite disappointed if a star vampire like Ignazio didn't get enough new
friends to play with.
Of course, on the whole picture, balancing the groups 15/10 would be more
sensible ; but having begun on one foot, changing suddenly would, well,
create a disturbing unbalance.
Not to mention that the G5s we currently have are nigh unplayable because of
their lack of allies not only in their clan but in other sects as well
(like, poor G5 !Tremere with no other G5, and not even enough Camarilla G4
!!).
I'll always be in favor of finishing a group for all the clans before
beginning a new one with a sprinkle of vampires. It may seem the commercial
thing to do, but it makes for temporary wallpaper and therefore isn't good
for the game in the long run.
--
Orpheus
----------------
Top of Ban / Fix List : PTO, Champion, Memories of Mortality.
On Sep 13, 2:13 pm, "John P." <jtpat...@mts.net> wrote:
> So currently the 4 main independant clans have the following numbers
> in vampires:
> Group 2/3/4/5
> Assamites: 26 / 2 / 10 / 1
> Followers: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0
> Giovanni: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0
> Ravnos: 24 / 2 / 11 / 0
>
> Assamites group 2 are +2 due to
> Tariq advanced and Tegerius. Followers
> are +1 in group 2 due to Kemintri
> and Gios are at +1 due to Ambrogino.
>
> This next set has 50+ new vampires, and from the checklist
> so far it appears that all are either Rav/Ass/Fol/Gio.
>
> I guess the starter only vampires are not included in the
> 50 new vampires mentioned for boosters so there is probably
> 62? new vampires. If we knock 2 off for oddities like new advanced
> vampires or something for group 3 or something we are left with
> 15 vampires per clan.
>
I read that there will be 175 new cards i the set total, and that 24
of these are start-only vampires. So we're looking at 50 vamps+ 24, or
74 vampires. That's 6+12 per clan if they are spreading them even
among the 4 indys, with 2 left over to give the Gios and Settites an
even spread or some G2 Ravnos ADV or what-have-you (Baali?
Abomination?). Probably filling out G4 to 15 and then buffing up
G5...to 15? There's only room for 5 more vamps per clan in G4 if the
cap is 15, and there will be 13 more vampires per clan if the spread
is 18 per clan.
That's a lot of ifs.
> We know that the four previewed vampires are half group 4,
> half group 5.
>
> It is unlikely that anything other than advanced vampires
> will be added to group 3 as group 2 is too huge to permit
> adding to gr 2/3.
>
> Are we going to see group 4 brought up to 15 vampires per clan
> like 3rd edition did for the sabbat clans? Can we expect 10/15/10/15
> in the future and group 5 will be the larger of the two?
>
> And how many expansions down the road are we away from
> the camarilla clans getting rounded out in group 4 (1 prince!
> in all group 4 for the cams right now).
>
There's got to be more than one prince in G4.
Lesse here, from Monger we have:
Name Clan Capacity
1. Mustafa, the Heir Ventrue 6
2. Mukhtar Bey Caitiff 7
3. Giangaleazzo, The Traitor Lasombra 8
Ah, there's only one Prince in the "Camarilla clans not counting
Caitiff who are actually Camarilla."
-Merlin
> I read that there will be 175 new cards i the set total, and that 24
> of these are start-only vampires. So we're looking at 50 vamps+ 24, or
> 74 vampires. That's 6+12 per clan if they are spreading them even
> among the 4 indys, with 2 left over to give the Gios and Settites an
> even spread or some G2 Ravnos ADV or what-have-you (Baali?
> Abomination?).
Maybe the "6th Bloodliner" ? Many bloodlines actually mix quite well with
the Indies...
> There's got to be more than one prince in G4.
>
> Lesse here, from Monger we have:
>
> Name Clan Capacity
> 1. Mustafa, the Heir Ventrue 6
> 2. Mukhtar Bey Caitiff 7
> 3. Giangaleazzo, The Traitor Lasombra 8
Don't forget that Victor Pelletier can be a Prince too !
But yes, hopefully with the next Camarilla expansion we'll get more titled
G4s. I'd like another Malkavian Prince, and a Brujah or two (sick and tired
of those Eurobrujahs !!)...
[ quoted text not captured ]
"Orpheus" <orphe...@free.fr> wrote in
news:46e980f0$0$27756$426a...@news.free.fr:
>> What do we want to see grouping wise?>
> The largest possible number of G4, as far as I'm concerned. I'd (I'll
> ?) be quite disappointed if a star vampire like Ignazio didn't get
> enough new friends to play with.
>
> Of course, on the whole picture, balancing the groups 15/10 would be
> more sensible ; but having begun on one foot, changing suddenly would,
> well, create a disturbing unbalance.
>
I respectfully disagree. If there needs to be a correction to the
proportions within groups for the Indies because of G2, I'd rather it be
immediate, and a one-shot deal. So, G3/4 will be a weak group pairing
forever. *shrug* Not a big deal, if it means Groups 4+ will be set aright,
and more in line with the Cams and Sabbat.
DZ
AW
On Sep 13, 1:27 pm, Merlin <hallofhadesco...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> > the camarilla clans getting rounded out in group 4 (1 prince!
> > in all group 4 for the cams right now).
>
> There's got to be more than one prince in G4.
>
> Lesse here, from Monger we have:
>
> Name Clan Capacity
> 1. Mustafa, the Heir Ventrue 6
> 2. Mukhtar Bey Caitiff 7
> 3. Giangaleazzo, The Traitor Lasombra 8
>
> Ah, there's only one Prince in the "Camarilla clans not counting
> Caitiff who are actually Camarilla."
>
> -Merlin
Yeah, I was leaving caitiff out as they are not "technically" a clan
and Giangaleazzo out as he is not a camarilla clan.
I had just noticed again that Brujah had not had
a new prince since Dark Sovereigns! Which means to this
day the Brujah have only one prince with presence.
An in-clan discipline! Its nuts. Made me rant
a bit. Maxwell does not count.
John P.
Winnipeg
[ quoted text not captured ]
Yes, those poor brujah, let's weep for them and their crappy princes.
If they could only have princes as good as the Gangrel's. :P
Comments Welcome,
Norman S. Brown, Jr
XZealot
Archon of the Swamp
[ quoted text not captured ]> Archon of the Swamp- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Hey the gangrel left the cam, they didn't want anything to do with
princes. :-)
There's this whole thing about their disciplines not affective
votes and stuff too... not having princes should not really
bother the gangrel. (They did get two new vampires with two votes)
-John P.
Winnipeg
[ quoted text not captured ]
Okay you get 6 points worth of disciplines and a 1 point title and a
worthless conditional special on a 9 cap (Katarina). Yeah!
...or You get Ingril Rossler with 7 points of disciplines, and a 1
point title with a good special but certainly not worth 3 points (see
Ian Forrestal for 3 point level goodness).
[ quoted text not captured ]
On 13 Wrz, 20:13, "John P." <jtpat...@mts.net> wrote:
> So currently the 4 main independant clans have the following numbers
> in vampires:
> Group 2/3/4/5
> Assamites: 26 / 2 / 10 / 1>> Followers: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0> Giovanni: 25 / 2 / 10 / 0
> Ravnos: 24 / 2 / 11 / 0> This next set has 50+ new vampires, and from the checklist> so far it appears that all are either Rav/Ass/Fol/Gio.
50 new vampires
>If we knock 2 off for oddities like new advanced
> vampires or something for group 3 or something we are left with
> 15 vampires per clan.
rather 12-13 vampires per clan
> We know that the four previewed vampires are half group 4,
> half group 5.
setites so far have 6 G4 and 3 G5 vampires.
> Are we going to see group 4 brought up to 15 vampires per clan
> like 3rd edition did for the sabbat clans? Can we expect 10/15/10/15
> in the future and group 5 will be the larger of the two?
> And how many expansions down the road are we away from
> the camarilla clans getting rounded out in group 4 (1 prince!
> in all group 4 for the cams right now).
right now we have 16 G4 setites and 3 G5 - i predict sth along 18-20
G4 and rest from G5
3 princes actually
<AcheronNi...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> the camarilla clans getting rounded out in group 4 (1 prince!
>> in all group 4 for the cams right now).>
> right now we have 16 G4 setites and 3 G5 - i predict sth along 18-20
> G4 and rest from G5
>
> 3 princes actually
Camarilla Clans. There are currently 7 camarilla clans. Caitiff are not
a clan and lasombra Antitribu are not a clan. 1 Prince in all of group
4 camarilla clans.
^^^^
Clans of course being what I intended to imply by the above.
Also I would check the rest of this thread. It has already been pointed
out that 50 is not a sure number at this point as there are uncommon
library cards. Unless you have additional info?
Right now we have a checklist that shows us 87 of 150 of the new
cards that can be found in the boosters including 23 booster only vampires.
That number does not include 11 starter only vampires.
That number does include 6 uncommon library cards which may displace
vampire cards from the booster sheet.
If it proceeds at this pace we would end up with 10 uncommon (ratioing 6
up to 150 cards from 87) library cards.
Assuming no common or rare vampire we would then have 40 vampires in booster
only distribution and at least 16 starter only vampires (assuming 4 per clan
as
4 assamites have already been identifed as starter only). Giving us 56
vampires,
or 14 from each clan.
I really hope Group 4 does not go above 18/20 or WW will repeat the Group 2
problem for
the independants. Too large a group, meaning the next group gets shafted.
I was really hoping that they would fall into 15/10 group pattern.
I guess if enough of the vamps are oddly designed and do not work well
together
this is not a big problem, but only a few more weeks will tell.
John P.
Winnipeg
On 15 Wrz, 01:50, "John P." <jtpat...@mts.net> wrote:
> Camarilla Clans. There are currently 7 camarilla clans. Caitiff are not
> a clan and lasombra Antitribu are not a clan. 1 Prince in all of group
> 4 camarilla clans.
7? i think that it is 6 cammy clans
brujah
nosferatu
malkavian
toreador
tremere
ventrue
[ quoted text not captured ]
i hope too that G4 wont be too big but it IS at least 16 G4
setites ...
i heave no outside info ... so there could be more than 50 vamps ...
(in KMW there was 58 and 122 in 3rd)
[ quoted text not captured ]
Yes, you could have some oddity like a non-unique vampire being in a
common spot.
Faceless Beauty
Giovanni
Capacity 3
pot dom pro
non-unique vampire
Faceless Beauty may not play action cards.
[ quoted text not captured ]
> Hey the gangrel left the cam, they didn't want anything to do with
> princes. :-)
>
> There's this whole thing about their disciplines not affective
> votes and stuff too... not having princes should not really
> bother the gangrel. (They did get two new vampires with two votes)
>
> -John P.
> Winnipeg
Yeah, voting with the Gangrel is not so effective (until you trash the
opposition voters, not impossible to do). However, Second Tradition,
Bloodhunt, The Progeny, etc. are all excellent cards for them. There
is more to Cam titles than just voting.
-Dave Clooney