[LSJ] Pounce + Immortal Grapple

Can both be used at the same time ? Sander

Sander Hanevelt wrote: > Can both be used at the same time ? I can't see why not. Peter D Bakija PD...@bigplanet.com http://www.myplanet.net/pdb6 "I am the autumn in the scarlet I am the make-up on your eyes" -Kim Deal

"Sander Hanevelt" <san...@vekn.net> wrote in message news:adgon4$hpb$1...@dinkel.civ.utwente.nl... > Can both be used at the same time ? > > Sander Pounce: Requires a ready minion with Flight. Strike: strength+2 damage, and the opposing minion cannot strike for the remainder of the round (this doesn't affect the current strike resolution). If this strike is dodged, this striking minion takes 1 damage during strike resolution and the opposing minion gets an optional press. Definition of a hand strike: And non ranged, non weapon strike, based on the user's strength. Pounce is a hand strike and is legal to play when you've been grappled.

"Sander Hanevelt" <san...@vekn.net> wrote in message news:<adgon4$hpb$1...@dinkel.civ.utwente.nl>... > Can both be used at the same time ? I was under the impression that, no, you couldn't... Immortal grapple only allows hand strikes, and Pounce is a strike that does strength damage, NOT a hand strike... Hence making The Lasombra's archived deck pretty crappy, but... ~SV I could be wrong.

"vermillian" <vermil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:f987c6cd.0206...@posting.google.com... > "Sander Hanevelt" <san...@vekn.net> wrote in message news:<adgon4$hpb$1...@dinkel.civ.utwente.nl>... > > Can both be used at the same time ? > > I was under the impression that, no, you couldn't... Immortal grapple > only allows hand strikes, and Pounce is a strike that does strength > damage, NOT a hand strike... > what do you think a hand strike is?

In message <f987c6cd.0206...@posting.google.com>, vermillian <vermil...@yahoo.com> writes: >I was under the impression that, no, you couldn't... Immortal grapple >only allows hand strikes, and Pounce is a strike that does strength >damage, NOT a hand strike... Hand strikes are strikes which: - do damage based on strength - CHECK - close range strikes - CHECK - not melee weapon strikes - CHECK Pounce is thus a hand strike. -- James Coupe PGP 0x5D623D5D I am woman. Here, me raw. EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 13D7E668C3695D623D5D

> Hand strikes are strikes which: > > - do damage based on strength - CHECK > - close range strikes - CHECK > - not melee weapon strikes - CHECK So at the same token would Scorpion愀 Touch also be a Hand Strike?? -- Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

In message <c10e19afe1ccc095cc2...@mygate.mailgate.org>, Claus Staal <c...@mbureauet.dk> writes: >> Hand strikes are strikes which: >> >> - do damage based on strength - CHECK >> - close range strikes - CHECK >> - not melee weapon strikes - CHECK > >So at the same token would Scorpion愀 Touch also be a Hand Strike?? If you choose to make a hand strike with Scorpion's Touch, yes. (You might have chosen a melee weapon strike, per card text.) Similarly, Undead Strength is a hand strike. Lucky Blow is a hand strike. Scorpion Sting is a hand strike. The fallback of Compress (pot) is a hand strike. The Khabar: Honor is a hand strike. Blissful Agony (ani fallback) is a hand strike. Thus, they would all (and plenty of other strikes) be playable under Immortal Grapple. Also, since hand strikes deal hand damage, they would all be subject to Wolf Claws (or similar) too. [ quoted text not captured ]

GreySeer wrote: > "Sander Hanevelt" <san...@vekn.net> wrote in message > > Can both [Pounce + Immortal Grapple] be used at the same time ? > > Pounce: > Requires a ready minion with Flight. Strike: strength+2 damage, and the > opposing minion cannot strike for the remainder of the round (this doesn't > affect the current strike resolution). If this strike is dodged, this > striking minion takes 1 damage during strike resolution and the opposing > minion gets an optional press. > > Definition of a hand strike: > And non ranged, non weapon strike, based on the user's strength. > > Pounce is a hand strike and is legal to play when you've been grappled. Correct. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote in message news:<mQB5pHja6F$8E...@gratiano.zephyr.org.uk>... > In message <f987c6cd.0206...@posting.google.com>, vermillian > <vermil...@yahoo.com> writes: > >I was under the impression that, no, you couldn't... Immortal grapple > >only allows hand strikes, and Pounce is a strike that does strength > >damage, NOT a hand strike... > > Hand strikes are strikes which: > > - do damage based on strength - CHECK > - close range strikes - CHECK > - not melee weapon strikes - CHECK > > Pounce is thus a hand strike. And garotte is not? SO confused... ~SV

vermillian wrote: > James Coupe <ja...@zephyr.org.uk> wrote in message > > Pounce is thus a hand strike. > > And garotte is not? Garrote is a melee weapon. It fails the "not a weapon" check. [ quoted text not captured ]

vermillian wrote: > And garotte is not? Garrotte is a weapon. You can't use weapons while immortally grappled. Only hand strikes. Weapons are based on strength damage, but are not hand strikes, as they are weapons. While Immotally Grappled, you may not use Brass Knuckles, Meat Cleaver, Sengir Dagger, or anything that is a weapon. They aren't hand strikes. Pounce is not a weapon. It is based on strength damage. It is non ranged. Thus, it is a hand strike. Garrotte is a weapon. Thus it fails the "Is it a hand strike" test. [ quoted text not captured ]

Peter D Bakija <PD...@bigplanet.com> wrote in message news:<B922B61D.3B1A%PD...@bigplanet.com>... > vermillian wrote: > > > And garotte is not? > > Garrotte is a weapon. You can't use weapons while immortally grappled. Only > hand strikes. > > Weapons are based on strength damage, but are not hand strikes, as they are > weapons. While Immotally Grappled, you may not use Brass Knuckles, Meat > Cleaver, Sengir Dagger, or anything that is a weapon. They aren't hand > strikes. > > Pounce is not a weapon. It is based on strength damage. It is non ranged. > Thus, it is a hand strike. > > Garrotte is a weapon. Thus it fails the "Is it a hand strike" test. Thanks. I missed the entire "not a weapon" bit... I reread the rule book (bottom of page 40 in the final nights rules) and checked it after I posted my comment, and then reread the post I replied to and realized how much of a doofus I was. I was hoping nobody would catch my garotte mistake thingy, but I should have known better and apologized right away. :) ~SV BTW this still means fun things like Scorpian's Sting are hand strikes though. And although I've long since learned this (the hard way) that Garrotte can't use a minions ag hand damage, I'd still like to damn it to hell (even though its useful with !Salubri still).