[fanset] 71 sample cards for discpline requiring cards [LONG]

These fill certain niches that your 'staple' cards would typically fill, yet are different. Some have texts a bit lengthy... Some have power levels I'm not entirely sure about. I may be missing certain aspects of a discipline, but (un?)fortunately I'm not planning on just keeping these cards, nor are all of these cards going to be included. Its just a start. Listed below, quite long, are 71 cards for ani, aus, cel, dom, for, pot, pre. I couldn't get obfuscate converted to xsl format in time prior to work. Sense Intent Reaction aus: +1 intercept AUS: As above, but the acting minion may not untap for the remainder of the turn. Future Sight Action +1 stealth action. Aus: put this card on the acting minion. This minion gets +1 intercept and -1 stealth on D actions. AUS: As above, but no stealth penalty. Aura Track Reaction aus: +1 intercept against a vampire with less blood than this reacting vampire. AUS: as above but if combat ensues, the vampire may not maneuver or press in the first round of combat. Fast Track Reaction aus: +1 intercept AUS: As above but if the block is unsuccessful you may return this card to your hand. Empathic Debate AM Reaction Gain one vote during a political action. Aus: If this vampire votes for or against a referendum and it passes, or fails, respectively, put this card on this vampire. You may tap this card during a referendum to give this vampire one vote. AUS: As above but you may tap it for 2 votes. Prophet's Vision Reaction Do not replace until end of the action.aus: +1 intercept. +2 if there is a Gehenna card in play. AUS: As above but you may look at the top 2 cards of your library when played and put them back on top of your deck in any order. The Future's Now Reaction Useable by a vampire of capacity greater than four. +1 intercept against D action only. aus: +1 intercept. AUS: as aus above but you may move up to two cards played during this action from your ashheap to your hand at the end of the action. Pattern's of Eternity Action +1 stealth action. 1 blood Put this card into play if you control no other Pattern's of Eternity. Tha: Burn this card to cancel the effect of a combat card as played. Aus: You may burn this card to cancel an action modifier as played. Aus Tha: You may burn this card to cancel a combat card or action modifier as played. Nuetral Form AM Play as the action is anounced. Vis: For the remainder of this action, at the beginning of a round of combat, this acting vampire may burn one blood to make its strikes undodgeable. Aus: For the remainder of this action, reacting vampires may not have more than one intercept. Apocalyptic Vision AM Reaction Only useable after an action has been successfully blocked. Aus: At anytime while in combat, if any, you may look at the top three cards of the opposing minion's controller's deck, or their hand. AUS: As above, but untap this vampire at the end of the combat if both minions are still ready. The Path of the Immortal Reaction aus: +1 intercept AUS: Useable by a tapped vampire. Untap this vampire. Sensing the Beast's Panic Reaction Only on a D action. Ani: +1 intercept. ANI: Useable by a tapped vampire. This vampire untaps and attempts to block. Once during this action this vampire may burn on blood to get +1 intercept. Antagonizing the Beast Reaction Only useable when you are being bled by a vampire with less blood than this reacting vampire. Ani: Reduce the amount of bleed against you by one. ANI: As above, but if the reacting vampire if able, it must reduce the amount of bleed by one more, else it burns one blood. Feral Pack Retainer 1 blood 2 life. Ani: +1 intercept against D actions choosing this minion, or any counters of card on the minion. ANI: As above, but this minion may prevent one damage once per combat. The Monster from the Woods Ally ghoul 2 blood 3 life 2 strength 0 bleed. You may play this card at ani for one additional pool if you do not have ani. Ani: as a D action may enter combat with a minion. Has an optional maneuver or press once per combat. ANI: As ani above, but has an additional strike, once per combat. Swarming Vermin Combat Only before range is determined in first round. Ani: For the remainder of combat, the opposing minion takes one damage during strike resolution, if the range is close. ANI: As above, but once per round, this vampire may burn one blood for a press. Poisonous Touch Combat Ani: Strike: Make a Hand Strike. Place this card on the opposing minion when the strike resolves. While this card is on the opposing minion, they must burn one blood when they wish to untap, or go to torpor. That vampire may burn this card by burning two blood. ANI: As above, but the cost to burn this card is four blood. The Animal Within Combat Play before range. Return this card from your discard pile to your hand at the end of combat, if the opposing minion ends combat as a strike. Ani: This vampire gets an optional press. vis: This round, this vampire may strike: Hand. The damage done from that strike is unpreventable. The Beast in the Mind AM 1 Blood ani: For the remainder of this action, any minion must burn one blood or life after they play a card. Chi: For the remainder of this action this vampire may burn one blood when a minion card is played to cancel its effects, unless the minion playing the card burns two blood or life. ani chi: as ani and chi above. Druidic Knowledge Action 1 Blood Requires a vampire capacity greater than four Tap any card in play that is not a minion. Ani: As above, but put this card on the acting minion, tapped. You may tap this card to tap any card in play that is not a minion. ANI: As ani above, but the cost to play this card is reduced by one blood. Instinctually Ruled AM Reaction 1 Blood Play after an action is successfully blocked. The resulting combat has a mandatory press. Ani: Play after successfully blocking. This minion may maneuver once per round in the resulting combat, if any. ANI: Play this card as an action is announced. During the first round of any combat during this action you may use a press or maneuver. If this minion is involved in that combat, the cost to play this card is reduced by one. Impressionable Fledglings Action Useable by a 5+ capacity vampire. Bleed at +1 bleed. dom: D action bleed +1. Vampires with less blood than this minion get -1 intercept when attempting to block. DOM: As above and move a blood from the blood bank to a younger uncontrolled minion in your uncontrolled region. Controlled Kine Ally mortal 1 pool dom: 1 life 1 strength 1 bleed DOM: As above but you may use a master phase action give this minion +1 stealth until the end of your turn. Impressive Stance Reaction Use while being bled. Dom: Play after you've declined to block. The acting minion may not play an action modifiers. DOM: As above, but you may play this card after the action is announced. Imprint Design AM 1 blood. If this bleed fails, or if the target of this bleed changes, you may recover the cost to play this card, and return it from your ashheap to your hand at the end of the action. Dom: +1 bleed. You may not play any additional bleed modifiers for the remainder of this action. DOM: as above, but +2 bleed. Beurocratic Trap AM dom: +1 bleed. No more bleed mods. DOM: Onl useable during a bleed action. Younger vampires get -1 intercept when attempting to block this action. Crafting the System Action 1 blood. Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Add or remove a counter from a master card you do not control. dom: d action, add or remove a counter from a card that is not a minion, controlled by another methuselah. DOM: As above, but it may be a card you control. Death Wish Action dom: D action. Choose a younger vampire to tap and place this card on them. The vampire with this card must burn one blood in order to block older vampires with dom. Nec: Choose and tap a vampire with less blood than this acting vampire. Place this card on them. A vampire with this card gets -1 intercept against vampires with necromancy that have more blood than them. Dark Servant Retainer mage 1 blood 1 life. dom: Minions must burn one blood or life to attempt to block the minion with Dark Servant. Obt: Before range is determined on the first round of combat, the opposing minion burns one blood or life. Dom obt: as dom and obt above. Theft of Freedom Action Minions do not tap after blocking this action. Requires a 5+ vampire. D action. A location controlled by your prey is burned unless your prey burns on pool. Dom: Choose a minion. If successful, move all retainers and equipment from that minion to this acting minion. DOM: Take control of an ally controlled by another methuselah. Lies and Liers AM Play during a bleed action as it is announced. Requires a vampires of capacity 5+. If this action is blocked, untap this acting minion. Dom: as above, but cancel the resulting combat if any. DOM: As dom above, and this vampire may bleed again this turn. Shrug off Combat for: prevent one non-agg damage, with an optional press, useable only to continue. FOR: Cancel a manuever and prevent up to 2 non agg damage or prevent up to two non-agg damage with an optional press, only to continue. Concentrate Combat for: Prevent up to all non-strike damage. FOR: As for above, but prevent one damage from the opposing minion's strike. Reserve Endurance Combat for: Prerange: Prevent one damage later this combat, or reduce the cost in blood to play a card this round. FOR: As above, but you may do both. Skin of Many Years Combat Requires a vampire of capacity 5+. Prevent one damage from an opposing minion's hand strike. For: as above, but prevent up to two. FOR: As for above, but prevent up to three damage from an opposing minon's strike Provisional Stamina AM If you play no additional cards this round, you may return this card from your ashheap to your hand after the end of the action. For: For the duration of this action, you may reduce the cost of a combat card played by one. FOR: As above but you may reduce the cost of an action modifier instead. Still Standing Combat Only playable if you are being dealt damage that would send you to torpor. For: Prevent up to two of that damage. FOR: Prevent up to four of that damage. Earthen Shield Combat Prerange. Pro: You may convert up to one non-ag damage being dealt to this vampire to normal damage. Ths vampire gets an optional press to end. For: You may prevent one damage from an opposing minion's strike. Pro For: As pro and for above, but this vampire may turn one unpreventable damage during combat into preventable damage. Image of Enduring Health Combat Do not replace until after combat. Prerange: For: For this round of combat, each combat card, beyond the opposing minion's first, costs the opposing minion an additional blood or life to play. Chi: Opposing minion gets -1 strength for this round of combat. For Chi: as for and chi above, but you have an optional press this round of combat. Walking Tall Combat Do not replace until after combat.Requires a 5+ vampire. Prerange: If this vampire is ready at the end of combat, untap it. For: As above, but you may prevent up to one damage. FOR: As for above, but with an optional press. Inner Focus Combat For: Strike: Untap this vampire with first strike. FOR: As for above, and you may prevent one damage in this round of combat. Chiseled Vigor Action Requires a vampire 5+. Put this card on the acting minion. A vampire may have only one Chiseled Form. You may tap this card to prevent one damage from an opposing minion's strike. For: As above, but you may discard a card from your hand, not replacing until the end of combat, to untap this card at the beginning of the first round of combat. FOR: As for above, but you may do this each round of combat. Too Furious Combat Prerange: Pot: For the remainder of combat, minions without POT take one damage during the press step, if combat during that round was close. POT: As above, but the opposing minion takes damage even if it has POT. Intimidating Rush Action Requires a 5+ vampire. D; Enter combat with a minion with less blood or life than this acting minion. Pot: as above but any minion that successfully blocks burns one blood or life before combat begins. POT: As pot above, but in every combat during this action, before range is determined on the first round of combat, the opposing minion takes one damage. Asphalt Crush Combat Prerange: pot: This minion gets +1 strength in this round of combat. POT: as above and the opposing minion gets -1 strength on this round of combat. Brutish Blow Combat 1 blood. If this strike is dodged you may replace this card in your hand during the press step. Pot: Strike: Hand +1 with an optional press. POT: As above but stike: hand +2. Fearful Might Combat 1 blood. Prerange: pot: The opposing minion may not strike with a card in play for this round of combat. POT: As above but nor can they strike with a card from their hand. Blatant Discouragement AM Reaction Only useable by an untapped titled vampire you control. Pot: Subtract this vampires voting contribution and tap this vampire to deal one damage to a vampire that is voting in a referendum. Any vampire that is no longer ready as a result of this card has its votes removed from the referendum's total. POT: As above, but do two damage to that vampire. Pole Shot Combat Only useable by a vampire of capacity 5+. Prereange. Place this card on the acting minion and treat it as a weapon. Burn this card at the end of a of combat. You may burn this card to strike: 1R. Pot: As above, but you may burn this card to strike: strength +1 ranged. POT: As above, but you may return this card from your ashheap to your hand at the end of a round this card was burned and the opposing minion is still ready. Rage of Hell Action 1 pool A vampire may only have one Rage of Hell. pot: place this card on the acting vampire. You may tap this card to give this vampire gets +1 strength in the first round of a combat. Obt: You may tap this card to give this vampire one additional strike in the first round of a combat. Pot obt: as pot and obt above, but this action is at +1 stealth. Strength from the Dead Action Combat Pot: Prerange: This vampire gets +1 strength for this round of combat. Nec: D; move a blood from a vampire with less blood than this acting vampire to this acting vampire. Pot Nec: As nec above, but put this card on the acting vampire. You may tap this card before range is determined in a round of combat to give this vampire +1 stregth for the remainder of the combat. A vampire may only have one Strength from the Dead. The Hit Action D; Do one point of damage to a minion with less blood or life than this acting minion. Pot: As above, but you may choose any minion. POT: as pot above, but you may return this card from your ashheap to your hand at the end of the action if the action is blocked. Concert Groupies Retainer mortal 1 blood 1 life. Pre: During a non-D action you may tap this card to give all minions with less blood or life than this acting minion -1 intercept. PRE: As pre above, but you do not need to tap this card. Supernatural Influence Action 1 blood. +1 stealth D action. Pre: Choose a non master card and place this card on it. The card with this card does not untap as normal. Burn this card during your next untap phase. PRE: As above but you may choose any card. Serving the Purpose Action 1 blood. Useable by a vampire capacity 5+. D action. Tap a vampire controlled by your prey. pre: Bleed. Tap a vampire controlled by your prey if the action is successful. PRE: As above, but bleed +1. In with the right society AM 1 blood pre: +1 bleed. Reduce the cost to play this card is your prey does not control an independent vampire or mortal ally or retainer. No more bleed mods. PRE: As above but at +2 bleed. Deathly Beautiful Action +1 stealth action. Put this card on the acting minion. Pre: you may burn this card before range is determined during combat to be abe to end combat as a strike. PRE: As above, but untap this vampire after you successfully perform this action. Grace of Helena Combat Do not replace until the next discard phase. Prerange. Pre: Tonce this combat, this minion may burn one blood to strike: end combat. Untap this vampire after strike resolution, if this is done. PRE: As above but you may replace this card immediately. Cult Follower Retainer mortal If Cult Follower was untapped since your last turn, it does not untap during your untap phase. 1 Life. Ser: Tap this card after this vampire succesffully performs an action (other than this recruitment) to give this vampire one blood. Pre: You may tap this card after a succesful action to draw a card. ser pre: as ser and pre above. Absentee Beauty AM/Reaction Useable by a tapped or untapped vampire not voting in a referendum. Play only after a referendum was succesful. Pre: this vampire gains one blood. PRE: As above, and you gain one pool. This Meeting Will Adjourn AM Useable only by a titled vampire. Useable by a vampire other than the acting minion. Gain one vote in a referendum. Pre: As above, and tapped vampires that have yet to vote, may not. PRE: As above, but gain three votes. Your Presence is Always Welcome AM/Reaction Useable after a referedum in which this vampire voted in agreement with the way it passed, ends. Pre: This vampire gains one blood and you may draw a card. PRE: Burn one blood and put this card on this vampire if it does not have this card on it already. The vampire with this card can tap this card to gain one vote in a referendum. Tough to Touch Combat Prerange. This vampire may strike: gain an optional additional strike, once this round of combat. cel: The opposing minion may not use any additional strikes for the remainder of combat. CEL: This vampire gets an optional additional strike this round of combat. Hit and Run Action cel: D action. Enter combat with a minion controlled by another methuselah. The acting minion gets an optional maneuver in the resulting combat. CEL: As above and you may untap this vampire at the end of the action. Reckless Assault Combat 1 blood. Prerange. Cel: This vampire gets an optional additional strike, maneuver, and press in this round of combat. If this vampire takes more than one point of damage this round of combat, do an additional point of damage to this vampire. CEL: As above, but the cost to play this card is reduced by one blood. Everywhere at Once AM 1 blood. Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Untap this vampire after a successful D action. cel: As above but reduce the cost to play this card by one. CEL: As above, but even if unsuccessful. Too Fast Combat Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. Bullet Dodger Combat Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. Quick and Restless Combat 1 Blood Once per combat, if combat ends the round of combat in which this card was played with both minions still ready, you may return this card to your hand at the end of combat, and recover the costs, if any. Cel: Maneuver with an optional press to continue. CEL: Prerange. This minion gets an optional maneuver and press to continue and an optional additional strike. Silent Speed Combat Do not replace until end of combat. cel: Manuever or press. Qui: Prerange. This minion burns one blood to get first strike for the remainder of combat. Cel Qui: as qui above, but this vampire may burn one blood to cancel a strike: dodge or S:CE card as played, once per combat. Long Stride Combat Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Maneuver only useable to go to long. Cel: Manuever. CEL: Play before strikes are declared. Change the range from long to short, or from short to long. Faster than Ever Combat Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Press, only useable to continue combat. Cel: Press. CEL: Play during press step as combat is about to end due to a lack of press to continue. A new combat begins (ending this current one).

vermillian wrote: > These fill certain niches that your 'staple' cards would typically > fill, yet are different. Some have texts a bit lengthy... Some have > power levels I'm not entirely sure about. Auspex needs more variety amongst its inferiors than "+1 intercept". A lot of the cards are pretty damn powerful: Empathic Reaction. Neutral Form is horrendously powerful for the [!]Malks. (+2 stealth, Neutral Form, as many bleed modifiers as I can lay down.). Monster from the Woods. Poisonous Touch. Superior Impressive Stance. Frickin' superior Fearful Might. Jesus. Mmmm. Rage of Hell. This Meeting Will Adjourn. I like how a lot of the nullferiors are conditional, but some of the more basic ones probably shouldn't be -- eg, a rush card, etc. I don't understand Antagonizing the Beast's superior. Nullferior Theft of Freedom is _way_ too weak. Arguably, the sup and inf should be flipped, too. For is...eh. There's very little diversity. Maybe to be expected, but I kept thinking I was looking at the same card over and over. Is Provisional Stamina "a" combat card, as in singular, or all combat cards? Earthen Shield: pro, I assume should read "up to one agg damage"? The for+pro is nice. Inner Focus: Why first strike? Cult Follower's wording is odd. Mmm. I'm seeing a lot of combat. Just off the top of my head, first deck I'd do would be Lasombra obt/pot/dom. pot/dom both have cards that force opponents to burn blood to block, and then I just smack the bejeezus out of them with the pot strikes/pot+obt additional strike. Meanwhile, superior Impressive Stance means they can't do nothing but hands for 1. They don't block, they get bled for bunches. Alternatively, cel/pre. Pre bleed (at some stealth, no less), and lots of Bullet Dodger. Interesting variety, though, for excluded. Good start. --Colin McGuigan

> Future Sight > Action > +1 stealth action. Aus: put this card on the acting minion. This > minion gets +1 intercept and -1 stealth on D actions. AUS: As above, > but no stealth penalty. > Sounds me as horribly powerfull, especially as it is stackable. It compltely breaks the stealth mechanic > The Future's Now > Reaction > Useable by a vampire of capacity greater than four. +1 intercept > against D action only. aus: +1 intercept. AUS: as aus above but you > may move up to two cards played during this action from your ashheap > to your hand at the end of the action. Euh, recursion is a bad thing. Just imagine Anneke with DOM Block The future's now Obedience Take these two cards back Apart from the fact that IMHO you seem to be an intercept lover > Pattern's of Eternity > Action > +1 stealth action. 1 blood Put this card into play if you control no > other Pattern's of Eternity. Tha: Burn this card to cancel the effect > of a combat card as played. Aus: You may burn this card to cancel an > action modifier as played. Aus Tha: You may burn this card to cancel a > combat card or action modifier as played. Beurk. Should be swept at your untap phase > Nuetral Form > AM > Play as the action is anounced. Vis: For the remainder of this action, > at the beginning of a round of combat, this acting vampire may burn > one blood to make its strikes undodgeable. Aus: For the remainder of > this action, reacting vampires may not have more than one intercept. Pouf, block impossible. Do you really think that is interesting ? > The Monster from the Woods > Ally > ghoul > 2 blood > 3 life 2 strength 0 bleed. You may play this card at ani for one > additional pool if you do not have ani. Ani: as a D action may enter > combat with a minion. Has an optional maneuver or press once per > combat. ANI: As ani above, but has an additional strike, once per > combat. > Euh, isni't someone broken ? Cost 2 blood, three life, a rush, a manouver, a press and an additional strike, strikes for two, non unique, no flaw. Please, back to the design board, Pox Fly wasn't an example of a blanced ally. > Poisonous Touch > Combat > Ani: Strike: Make a Hand Strike. Place this card on the opposing > minion when the strike resolves. While this card is on the opposing > minion, they must burn one blood when they wish to untap, or go to > torpor. That vampire may burn this card by burning two blood. ANI: As > above, but the cost to burn this card is four blood. First it should be a quitus card, second it is somewhat overpowered as it sensory deprives a vmapire with lesse than four blood quite easily > Walking Tall > Combat > Do not replace until after combat.Requires a 5+ vampire. Prerange: If > this vampire is ready at the end of combat, untap it. For: As above, > but you may prevent up to one damage. FOR: As for above, but with an > optional press. !Yeah, multirush for anyone. Funny isn't it ? Just joking. > Asphalt Crush > Combat > Prerange: pot: This minion gets +1 strength in this round of combat. > POT: as above and the opposing minion gets -1 strength on this round > of combat. Euh, damage prevention ? You are giving potence exctly what it lacks, threby overpowering it. > Fearful Might > Combat > 1 blood. Prerange: pot: The opposing minion may not strike with a card > in play for this round of combat. POT: As above but nor can they > strike with a card from their hand. Euh, POT version is definitely overpowered, and reminds me the old thoughts betrayed, or some sort of coordinate attacks without the requirement > Pole Shot > Combat > Only useable by a vampire of capacity 5+. Prereange. Place this card > on the acting minion and treat it as a weapon. Burn this card at the > end of a of combat. You may burn this card to strike: 1R. Pot: As > above, but you may burn this card to strike: strength +1 ranged. POT: > As above, but you may return this card from your ashheap to your hand > at the end of a round this card was burned and the opposing minion is > still ready. Euh, you really like POT, don't you ? > Rage of Hell > Action > 1 pool > A vampire may only have one Rage of Hell. pot: place this card on the > acting vampire. You may tap this card to give this vampire gets +1 > strength in the first round of a combat. Obt: You may tap this card to > give this vampire one additional strike in the first round of a > combat. Pot obt: as pot and obt above, but this action is at +1 > stealth. Firsdt it's overpowerd (compare it to black metamorphosis). Second, I don't think that cards requiring two inferior discipline should be more powerfull than a superior discipline of a card, especially while considering these disciplines belong to a certain clan. Are you a lasombra lover ? > Deathly Beautiful > Action > +1 stealth action. Put this card on the acting minion. Pre: you may > burn this card before range is determined during combat to be abe to > end combat as a strike. PRE: As above, but untap this vampire after > you successfully perform this action. Nice one. Should cost at least a blood, perhaps have a capcity requirement but I think such a card could bring fresh blood to the game. > Absentee Beauty > AM/Reaction > Useable by a tapped or untapped vampire not voting in a referendum. > Play only after a referendum was succesful. Pre: this vampire gains > one blood. PRE: As above, and you gain one pool. Anarch revolt, yeah !!!! > This Meeting Will Adjourn > AM > Useable only by a titled vampire. Useable by a vampire other than the > acting minion. Gain one vote in a referendum. Pre: As above, and > tapped vampires that have yet to vote, may not. PRE: As above, but > gain three votes. > > > Hit and Run > Action > cel: D action. Enter combat with a minion controlled by another > methuselah. The acting minion gets an optional maneuver in the > resulting combat. CEL: As above and you may untap this vampire at the > end of the action. Hum. As a regular CEL player I would love it, but it's definitely not balanced > Everywhere at Once > AM > 1 blood. Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Untap this vampire after a > successful D action. cel: As above but reduce the cost to play this > card by one. CEL: As above, but even if unsuccessful. Freak drive, yeah !!! > Too Fast > Combat > Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without > cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. You like Toreador, don't you ? > Quick and Restless > Combat > 1 Blood > Once per combat, if combat ends the round of combat in which this card > was played with both minions still ready, you may return this card to > your hand at the end of combat, and recover the costs, if any. Cel: > Maneuver with an optional press to continue. CEL: Prerange. This > minion gets an optional maneuver and press to continue and an optional > additional strike. Recursion is a BAD thing. Use this card, a gun and you put 2 or 4 damage on any opponent any first round of combat. Next round you use teh gun's manouver, inflict dmae at long which sends opponent to torpor, and you expanded NOTING : not a single card > Silent Speed > Combat > Do not replace until end of combat. cel: Manuever or press. Qui: > Prerange. This minion burns one blood to get first strike for the > remainder of combat. Cel Qui: as qui above, but this vampire may burn > one blood to cancel a strike: dodge or S:CE card as played, once per > combat. silent speed + aggraveated dammage(blow torch) => almost guaranteed torpor except agasint dame prevention. Perhaps a little overpowered These were just a few thoughts. By the way I forgot one domibate card that made something ilke "bleed, untap if blocked, bleed again"

As a (!)Tremere fan I suggest the following Thaumaturgy cards: "Deflection of wooden doom" Combat Cost: 1 Blood tha: This vampire treats aggravated damage as normal for the remainer of this round. THA: As above but may prevent one damage. "Pavis of Foul Prescence" Action Cost: 1 Blood tha: Put this card on target vampire, this vampire may not use cards requiring Prescense. You still control this card. That vampire may remove this card as a D action costing 2 blood. THA: Put this card on one of your vampires. That vampire may not be targeted by an action card that require prescence and prescence cards may not played against this vampire during combat. "Blood of Potency" Combat tha: Play this card immediently before combat. This vampire only half of the blood cost for any cards he or she plays during this combat. Only one blood of potency at inferior may be played during this combat THA: For this combat every blood this vampire removes heals two damage. "Escape to a True Friend" Combat Cost: 1 Blood tha: Strike Combat Ends. THA: As above but this card may be played before range is chosen.

vermillian wrote: > > Aura Track > Reaction > aus: +1 intercept against a vampire with less blood than this reacting > vampire. AUS: as above but if combat ensues, the vampire may not > maneuver or press in the first round of combat. ..., the *acting* vampie may not... > Empathic Debate > AM Reaction > Gain one vote during a political action. Aus: If this vampire votes > for or against a referendum and it passes, or fails, respectively, put > this card on this vampire. You may tap this card during a referendum > to give this vampire one vote. AUS: As above but you may tap it for 2 > votes. That seems quite strong... Getting auspex to have votes at all is a bit strange, but this is permanent... > Prophet's Vision > Reaction > Do not replace until end of the action.aus: +1 intercept. +2 if there > is a Gehenna card in play. AUS: As above but you may look at the top 2 > cards of your library when played and put them back on top of your > deck in any order. We're still talking about the draft set? Why make it work with Gehenna cards? You won't be seeing them in the draft. > Apocalyptic Vision > AM Reaction > Only useable after an action has been successfully blocked. Aus: At > anytime while in combat, if any, you may look at the top three cards > of the opposing minion's controller's deck, or their hand. AUS: As > above, but untap this vampire at the end of the combat if both minions > are still ready. Why not make it a combat card only usable when blocking? > Sensing the Beast's Panic > Reaction > Only on a D action. Ani: +1 intercept. ANI: Useable by a tapped > vampire. This vampire untaps and attempts to block. Once during this > action this vampire may burn on blood to get +1 intercept. The trend seems to be to make untapping cost 1 blood? > Antagonizing the Beast > Reaction > Only useable when you are being bled by a vampire with less blood than > this reacting vampire. Ani: Reduce the amount of bleed against you by > one. ANI: As above, but if the reacting vampire if able, it must > reduce the amount of bleed by one more, else it burns one blood. 'if the reacting vampire is able'? I think you meant to get the effect of: vamp A bleeds for 1, vamp B plays this card supperior ANI, bleed is reduced to 0, vamp A burns one blood because the bleed would be reduced one further but can't coz the bleed was only for 1. You need different words to achieve such an effect. ANI: as above, but reduce bleed by 2. If this reduces the bleed the bleed to less then 0, acting vampire burns 1 blood. > The Monster from the Woods > Ally > ghoul > 2 blood > 3 life 2 strength 0 bleed. You may play this card at ani for one > additional pool if you do not have ani. Ani: as a D action may enter > combat with a minion. Has an optional maneuver or press once per > combat. ANI: As ani above, but has an additional strike, once per > combat. So at ANI you get a Renegade Garou *with a press* for 5 less pool, and only two blood from a vamp. Somehow, this seems a bit overpowered... > Impressive Stance > Reaction > Use while being bled. Dom: Play after you've declined to block. The > acting minion may not play an action modifiers. DOM: As above, but you > may play this card after the action is announced. I like this one. Dominate getting an anti-Dominate card :) > Lies and Liers > AM > Play during a bleed action as it is announced. Requires a vampires of > capacity 5+. If this action is blocked, untap this acting minion. Dom: > as above, but cancel the resulting combat if any. DOM: As dom above, > and this vampire may bleed again this turn. Should cost 1 blood. > Walking Tall > Combat > Do not replace until after combat.Requires a 5+ vampire. Prerange: If > this vampire is ready at the end of combat, untap it. For: As above, > but you may prevent up to one damage. FOR: As for above, but with an > optional press. Should cost 1 blood (untap) > Inner Focus > Combat > For: Strike: Untap this vampire with first strike. FOR: As for above, > and you may prevent one damage in this round of combat. What's the use of untapping with first strike? Untapping means nothing in the combat. How about: for: untap this vampire, only playable during strike resolution. FOR: prevent 1 damage and untap this vampire. Then you can play it in addition to a strike, more useful anyway :) > Blatant Discouragement > AM Reaction > Only useable by an untapped titled vampire you control. Pot: Subtract > this vampires voting contribution and tap this vampire to deal one > damage to a vampire that is voting in a referendum. Any vampire that > is no longer ready as a result of this card has its votes removed from > the referendum's total. POT: As above, but do two damage to that > vampire. I suppose you mean to say that this reacting vampire does not vote, instead of that 'substract this vampire's voting contribution' I'll check ou the rest later. > Pole Shot Starting fromthere (reminder for myself) -- "Wees jezelf, er zijn al zoveel anderen" - Loesje begin Your_MS_program_incorrectly_interprets_this_as_an_attachment.txt

Emmanuel Martin wrote: Just a few notes. I agree with you on a number of things, and so snipped those, because I have a reputation to protect. >>Future Sight >>Action >>+1 stealth action. Aus: put this card on the acting minion. This >>minion gets +1 intercept and -1 stealth on D actions. AUS: As above, >>but no stealth penalty. >> > > Sounds me as horribly powerfull, especially as it is stackable. It > compltely breaks the stealth mechanic So's Rock Bat. Or Sports Bikes. Or Raven Spies. Or... >>Pattern's of Eternity >>Action >>+1 stealth action. 1 blood Put this card into play if you control no >>other Pattern's of Eternity. Tha: Burn this card to cancel the effect >>of a combat card as played. Aus: You may burn this card to cancel an >>action modifier as played. Aus Tha: You may burn this card to cancel a >>combat card or action modifier as played. > > Beurk. Should be swept at your untap phase That'd make it as useless as "Sleep Unseen". =P >>Asphalt Crush >>Combat >>Prerange: pot: This minion gets +1 strength in this round of combat. >>POT: as above and the opposing minion gets -1 strength on this round >>of combat. > > Euh, damage prevention ? You are giving potence exctly what it lacks, > threby overpowering it. See also: Stunt Cycle. Also, plenty of strikes don't do damage based on hand strength, so it's poor damage prevention at that. --Colin McGuigan

"Colin McGuigan" <magu...@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message news:VLWdnYuKjNT...@speakeasy.net... > Emmanuel Martin wrote: > > Sounds me as horribly powerfull, especially as it is stackable. It > > compltely breaks the stealth mechanic > > So's Rock Bat. Or Sports Bikes. Or Raven Spies. Or... Note: Sport Bikes aren't stackable. They're vehicles. A minion can have only 1 vehicle. -- LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc. Links to V:TES news, rules, cards, utilities, and tournament calendar: http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

LSJ wrote: > Note: Sport Bikes aren't stackable. > They're vehicles. A minion can have only 1 vehicle. Sorry. Typo. I misspelled "Raptor". --Colin McGuigan

vermillian wrote: > > Concert Groupies > Retainer > mortal > 1 blood > 1 life. Pre: During a non-D action you may tap this card to give all > minions with less blood or life than this acting minion -1 intercept. > PRE: As pre above, but you do not need to tap this card. I guess you mean 'an acting minion you control' rather than 'this acting minion' Also, the superior seems a bit strong. You can simply keep dishing out -1 intercept, for each vote you call ;) > Supernatural Influence > Action > 1 blood. +1 stealth D action. Pre: Choose a non master card and place > this card on it. The card with this card does not untap as normal. > Burn this card during your next untap phase. PRE: As above but you may > choose any card. Not untapping a card for 1 turn, costing 1 blood. I guess it's okay, but somehow this seems a bit expensive. Could be free I think. Unless you add 'tap this card and it does not untap', then the 1 blood cost would be fine, maybe even make it 2. > Tough to Touch > Combat > Prerange. This vampire may strike: gain an optional additional strike, > once this round of combat. cel: The opposing minion may not use any > additional strikes for the remainder of combat. CEL: This vampire gets > an optional additional strike this round of combat. strike: gain an additional strike?? Erm, if you leave the "strike:" part out, it would be a nice card. Like this you'd have to be a sitting duck the first time strikes are done, just so you can strike in an additional strike... Pretty useless, unless responding to a dodge. > Hit and Run > Action > cel: D action. Enter combat with a minion controlled by another > methuselah. The acting minion gets an optional maneuver in the > resulting combat. CEL: As above and you may untap this vampire at the > end of the action. I think I'd make this +1 stealth. inferior is just Bum's Rush otherwise. > Too Fast > Combat > Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without > cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. Better not use 'as above' but simply: CEL: This vampire burns one blood to end this combat. > > Bullet Dodger > Combat > Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card > was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during > the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional > strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional > strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. CEL: useable at long I guess? or cel at long? > Long Stride > Combat > Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Maneuver only useable to go to long. > Cel: Manuever. CEL: Play before strikes are declared. Change the range > from long to short, or from short to long. CEL: "play after range has been determined" instead? Nice list. Hope my comments were useful. //Doc. [ quoted text not captured ]

The Doctor wrote: >> Concert Groupies >> Retainer >> mortal >> 1 blood >> 1 life. Pre: During a non-D action you may tap this card to give all >> minions with less blood or life than this acting minion -1 intercept. >> PRE: As pre above, but you do not need to tap this card. > > I guess you mean 'an acting minion you control' rather than 'this acting > minion' It's a retainer, so "this acting minion" seems entirely correct. >> Tough to Touch >> Combat >> Prerange. This vampire may strike: gain an optional additional strike, >> once this round of combat. cel: The opposing minion may not use any >> additional strikes for the remainder of combat. CEL: This vampire gets >> an optional additional strike this round of combat. > > strike: gain an additional strike?? > > Erm, if you leave the "strike:" part out, it would be a nice card. > Like this you'd have to be a sitting duck the first time strikes are > done, just so you can strike in an additional strike... > Pretty useless, unless responding to a dodge. Disciplineless. And I think getting around dodges is more or less the point. You take their strike, and then have a better chance of yours hitting home. >> Too Fast >> Combat >> Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without >> cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. > > Better not use 'as above' but simply: > CEL: This vampire burns one blood to end this combat. The intent is probably not let it be used against another CEL minion. >> Bullet Dodger >> Combat >> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card >> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during >> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional >> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional >> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. > > CEL: useable at long I guess? or cel at long? Probably cel at long. Makes more sense to dodge the bullets if you're far away. But who knows? --Colin McGuigan

Colin McGuigan wrote: > The Doctor wrote: > >>> Concert Groupies >>> Retainer >>> mortal >>> 1 blood >>> 1 life. Pre: During a non-D action you may tap this card to give all >>> minions with less blood or life than this acting minion -1 intercept. >>> PRE: As pre above, but you do not need to tap this card. >> >> >> I guess you mean 'an acting minion you control' rather than 'this >> acting minion' > > > It's a retainer, so "this acting minion" seems entirely correct. Ah, doh. Misread it as an ally. >>> Too Fast >>> Combat >>> Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without >>> cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. >> >> >> Better not use 'as above' but simply: >> CEL: This vampire burns one blood to end this combat. > > The intent is probably not let it be used against another CEL minion. Guess we'll have to wait for the OP for that. >>> Bullet Dodger >>> Combat >>> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card >>> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during >>> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional >>> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional >>> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. >> >> CEL: useable at long I guess? or cel at long? > > Probably cel at long. Makes more sense to dodge the bullets if you're > far away. But who knows? The OP knows :) [ quoted text not captured ]

h...@operamail.com (Haakon Olav Thunestvedt) wrote in message news:<3ed6ceea.04070...@posting.google.com>... > As a (!)Tremere fan I suggest the following Thaumaturgy cards: > "Deflection of wooden doom" > Combat > Cost: 1 Blood > tha: This vampire treats aggravated damage as normal for the remainer > of this round. THA: As above but may prevent one damage. Though there is some president to allow for tha to have agg prevention, I'm not sure this belongs in a base set. If I include environmental agg damage to both sides of combat type card for tha, or in the set at all, this would be a nice addition for comboing perposes. > "Pavis of Foul Prescence" > Action > Cost: 1 Blood > tha: Put this card on target vampire, this vampire may not use cards > requiring Prescense. You still control this card. That vampire may > remove this card as a D action costing 2 blood. THA: Put this card on > one of your vampires. That vampire may not be targeted by an action > card that require prescence and prescence cards may not played against > this vampire during combat. Too corner case to be very applicable for a draft. > "Blood of Potency" > Combat > tha: Play this card immediently before combat. This vampire only half > of the blood cost for any cards he or she plays during this combat. > Only one blood of potency at inferior may be played during this combat > THA: For this combat every blood this vampire removes heals two > damage. More of a niche for for to have than tha. > "Escape to a True Friend" > Combat > Cost: 1 Blood > tha: Strike Combat Ends. THA: As above but this card may be played > before range is chosen. Combat defense in this form isn't in tha. best interest for a base set. What we expect from tha is blood stealing, ranged damage, actions that protect or mess people up and maybe some presses maneuvers and second round crap. Your thoughts? ~SV

Colin McGuigan <magu...@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message news:<kdKdndsy5rs...@speakeasy.net>... > vermillian wrote: > > These fill certain niches that your 'staple' cards would typically > > fill, yet are different. Some have texts a bit lengthy... Some have > > power levels I'm not entirely sure about. > > Auspex needs more variety amongst its inferiors than "+1 intercept". But it needs to be "the best at intercept" doesn't it? > A lot of the cards are pretty damn powerful: Empathic Reaction. Neutral > Form is horrendously powerful for the [!]Malks. (+2 stealth, Neutral > Form, as many bleed modifiers as I can lay down.). Yeah, I know... whoops! :) > Monster from the > Woods. Should have been listed as 2 pool with 2 life. On par with allies being created now a days. > Poisonous Touch. Blood burnage needs toned down, but I really don't think its an animalism-esque effect anyhow and it needs a replacement (a combat card tough to dodge akin to scorpian's touch). > Superior Impressive Stance. Yes, the sup is a tad strong... Needs tweaking but I like the inf. > Frickin' superior > Fearful Might. Just needs a DNR and the superior needs to do JUST and not AS ABOVE (that way you need two of them, in hand, to limit them to striking just hands... hmmm. grapple seems easier pretty much, doesn't it? But at about the original power curve I intended it to be). > Jesus. Mmmm. Rage of Hell. Note its one or the other and only in ONE combat until your next turn, for ONE ROUND. Not too strong at all. > This Meeting Will Adjourn. What is so strong about it? I think the inferior and superior need switched, that's all. > I like how a lot of the nullferiors are conditional, but some of the > more basic ones probably shouldn't be -- eg, a rush card, etc. We haven't gotton to all the cards yet. > I don't understand Antagonizing the Beast's superior. Um... see some other dude's post that better explains the intent of this card. > Nullferior Theft of Freedom is _way_ too weak. Arguably, the sup and > inf should be flipped, too. Yeah that whole cards wack. I was trying to cover all permanent control on one dom card... > For is...eh. There's very little diversity. Maybe to be expected, but > I kept thinking I was looking at the same card over and over. Read em. Subtle differences. :) > Is Provisional Stamina "a" combat card, as in singular, or all combat cards? > > Earthen Shield: pro, I assume should read "up to one agg damage"? The > for+pro is nice. > > Inner Focus: Why first strike? So they don't get torped before the untap happens? > Cult Follower's wording is odd. > > Mmm. I'm seeing a lot of combat. Just off the top of my head, first > deck I'd do would be Lasombra obt/pot/dom. pot/dom both have cards that > force opponents to burn blood to block, and then I just smack the > bejeezus out of them with the pot strikes/pot+obt additional strike. > Meanwhile, superior Impressive Stance means they can't do nothing but > hands for 1. They don't block, they get bled for bunches. > > Alternatively, cel/pre. Pre bleed (at some stealth, no less), and lots > of Bullet Dodger. Its things like this that I need. Decks you'd build out of just these cards. Thanks for the info. Card suggestions yourself? ~SV

Colin McGuigan <magu...@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message news:<3rydnSrPJ-j...@speakeasy.net>... > >> Too Fast > >> Combat > >> Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without > >> cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. > > > > Better not use 'as above' but simply: > > CEL: This vampire burns one blood to end this combat. > > The intent is probably not let it be used against another CEL minion. Yep. > >> Bullet Dodger > >> Combat > >> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card > >> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during > >> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional > >> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional > >> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. > > > > CEL: useable at long I guess? or cel at long? > > Probably cel at long. Makes more sense to dodge the bullets if you're > far away. But who knows? Dyslexia. Long and close got mixed in my mind. I'm crazy. :) I don't like this card though. Seems like a weak draft card... I guess we'd have to see how good and frequent other long range strikes are? :) ~SV

e...@boursorama.com (Emmanuel Martin) wrote in message news:<10c2c156.04070...@posting.google.com>... > > The Future's Now > > Reaction > > Useable by a vampire of capacity greater than four. +1 intercept > > against D action only. aus: +1 intercept. AUS: as aus above but you > > may move up to two cards played during this action from your ashheap > > to your hand at the end of the action. > Euh, recursion is a bad thing. Just imagine Anneke with DOM > Block > The future's now > Obedience > Take these two cards back > Apart from the fact that IMHO you seem to be an intercept lover Fetch tow OTHER (added) cards. Hows that? > > Pattern's of Eternity > > Action > > +1 stealth action. 1 blood Put this card into play if you control no > > other Pattern's of Eternity. Tha: Burn this card to cancel the effect > > of a combat card as played. Aus: You may burn this card to cancel an > > action modifier as played. Aus Tha: You may burn this card to cancel a > > combat card or action modifier as played. > > Beurk. Should be swept at your untap phase. Agreed. > > Nuetral Form > > AM > > Play as the action is anounced. Vis: For the remainder of this action, > > at the beginning of a round of combat, this acting vampire may burn > > one blood to make its strikes undodgeable. Aus: For the remainder of > > this action, reacting vampires may not have more than one intercept. > > Pouf, block impossible. Do you really think that is interesting ? Yeah, I'm stupid. Suggestions? > > The Monster from the Woods > > Ally > > ghoul > > 2 pool > > 2 life 2 strength 0 bleed. You may play this card at ani for one > > additional pool if you do not have ani. Ani: as a D action may enter > > combat with a minion. Has an optional maneuver or press once per > > combat. ANI: As ani above, but has an additional strike, once per > > combat. > > > Euh, isni't someone broken ? Cost 2 blood, three life, a rush, a > manouver, a press and an additional strike, strikes for two, non > unique, no flaw. Please, back to the design board, Pox Fly wasn't an > example of a blanced ally. Hows the change above? Note, maneuver OR press. > > Poisonous Touch > > Combat > > Ani: Strike: Make a Hand Strike. Place this card on the opposing > > minion when the strike resolves. While this card is on the opposing > > minion, they must burn one blood when they wish to untap, or go to > > torpor. That vampire may burn this card by burning two blood. ANI: As > > above, but the cost to burn this card is four blood. > First it should be a quitus card, second it is somewhat overpowered as > it sensory deprives a vmapire with lesse than four blood quite easily Not a sense dep, but yeah. Needs wording change and potential nixing. Not really an ani card. Alternative suggestion? > > Walking Tall > > Combat > > Do not replace until after combat.Requires a 5+ vampire. Prerange: If > > this vampire is ready at the end of combat, untap it. For: As above, > > but you may prevent up to one damage. FOR: As for above, but with an > > optional press. > !Yeah, multirush for anyone. Funny isn't it ? Just joking. I think its just fine. They've got to survive a combat with a hand size of 6. Maybe a burn blood clause. > > Asphalt Crush > > Combat > > Prerange: pot: This minion gets +1 strength in this round of combat. > > POT: as above and the opposing minion gets -1 strength on this round > > of combat. > Euh, damage prevention ? You are giving potence exctly what it lacks, > threby overpowering it. Stunt Cycle. Reduce hand strength is prevention? > > Fearful Might > > Combat > > 1 blood. Prerange: pot: The opposing minion may not strike with a card > > in play for this round of combat. POT: As above but nor can they > > strike with a card from their hand. > > Euh, POT version is definitely overpowered, and reminds me the old > thoughts betrayed, or some sort of coordinate attacks without the > requirement POT is a ONLY not an AS ABOVE (or it should have been.) Needs a DNR. Now its ok. > > > Pole Shot > > Combat > > Only useable by a vampire of capacity 5+. Prereange. Place this card > > on the acting minion and treat it as a weapon. Burn this card at the > > end of a of combat. You may burn this card to strike: 1R. Pot: As > > above, but you may burn this card to strike: strength +1 ranged. POT: > > As above, but you may return this card from your ashheap to your hand > > at the end of a round this card was burned and the opposing minion is > > still ready. > Euh, you really like POT, don't you ? How is this broke? It's almost as good as a thrown gate... worse with teh capacity requirment. > > Rage of Hell > > Action > > 1 pool > > A vampire may only have one Rage of Hell. pot: place this card on the > > acting vampire. You may tap this card to give this vampire gets +1 > > strength in the first round of a combat. Obt: You may tap this card to > > give this vampire one additional strike in the first round of a > > combat. Pot obt: as pot and obt above, but this action is at +1 > > stealth. > > Firsdt it's overpowerd (compare it to black metamorphosis). Second, I > don't think that cards requiring two inferior discipline should be > more powerfull than a superior discipline of a card, especially while > considering these disciplines belong to a certain clan. Are you a > lasombra lover ? They get one or the other in tapping it. Not both. For ONE ROUND. Its a pool! ON PAR with black mamajamma. > > Deathly Beautiful > > Action > > +1 stealth action. Put this card on the acting minion. Pre: you may > > burn this card before range is determined during combat to be abe to > > end combat as a strike. PRE: As above, but untap this vampire after > > you successfully perform this action. > Nice one. Should cost at least a blood, perhaps have a capcity > requirement but I think such a card could bring fresh blood to the > game. Requires an action replaces the blood cost of majesty. I'd say its worse, so I moved the SCE to the prerange. > > Hit and Run > > Action > > cel: D action. Enter combat with a minion controlled by another > > methuselah. The acting minion gets an optional maneuver in the > > resulting combat. CEL: As above and you may untap this vampire at the > > end of the action. > Hum. As a regular CEL player I would love it, but it's definitely not > balanced Its a bum's rush with a replace, that untaps you if successful. Erm... ok add that line to it instead of "at end of action". > > Everywhere at Once > > AM > > 1 blood. Requires a 5+ capacity vampire. Untap this vampire after a > > successful D action. cel: As above but reduce the cost to play this > > card by one. CEL: As above, but even if unsuccessful. > Freak drive, yeah !!! For a 5 cap for a blood (or not). I think its fine. > > Too Fast > > Combat > > Prerange; Cel: Burn one blood to end combat against a minion without > > cel. CEL: As above, but even against a minion with cel. > You like Toreador, don't you ? Yeah. I don't like this, but for other reasons. Don't think it belongs in a draft and its not celerity-esque enough. > > Quick and Restless > > Combat > > 1 Blood > > Once per combat, if combat ends the round of combat in which this card > > was played with both minions still ready, you may return this card to > > your hand at the end of combat, and recover the costs, if any. Cel: > > Maneuver with an optional press to continue. CEL: Prerange. This > > minion gets an optional maneuver and press to continue and an optional > > additional strike. > Recursion is a BAD thing. Use this card, a gun and you put 2 or 4 > damage on any opponent any first round of combat. Next round you use > teh gun's manouver, inflict dmae at long which sends opponent to > torpor, and you expanded NOTING : not a single card Yeah, change the replace clause to SCE and S:dodge and we're talking ok. > > Silent Speed > > Combat > > Do not replace until end of combat. cel: Manuever or press. Qui: > > Prerange. This minion burns one blood to get first strike for the > > remainder of combat. Cel Qui: as qui above, but this vampire may burn > > one blood to cancel a strike: dodge or S:CE card as played, once per > > combat. > > silent speed + aggraveated dammage(blow torch) => almost guaranteed > torpor except agasint dame prevention. Perhaps a little overpowered So they play another SCE or SDOdge or prevent it, or frippin' go to long (ok so you've an ivory bow... but not in the draft set you don't!). A little on the high side, but not too high. Show me later when we design more cards for this set how its broke, and show me how bad it would hurt regular play (assuming this card ever mixed with 'regular' cards) that much. > > These were just a few thoughts. By the way I forgot one domibate card > that made something ilke "bleed, untap if blocked, bleed again" Yeah, that's a bit much... I like the concept though. Maybe Bleed, untap if blocked, burn a blood to bleed. Note: they could just NOT BLOCK (its played as action is announced). ~SV

vermillian wrote: >>>>Bullet Dodger >>>>Combat >>>>Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card >>>>was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during >>>>the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional >>>>strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional >>>>strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. > Dyslexia. Long and close got mixed in my mind. I'm crazy. :) I don't > like this card though. Seems like a weak draft card... I guess we'd > have to see how good and frequent other long range strikes are? :) Are you kidding? This is about the ultimate combat defense card someone could get, at CEL. Unless you specifically have a card that ignores dodges, you can't touch me. Press all you want -- I can play this (same copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. If you generate more than one additional strike, I just play another copy of this card. --Colin McGuigan

vermillian wrote: > But it needs to be "the best at intercept" doesn't it? Yep. Picky, aren't I? =P >> Monster from the Woods > > Should have been listed as 2 pool with 2 life. On par with allies > being created now a days. 2 pool is more reasonable, yeah. Still kinda powerful. Give it a gun and it walks all over non-combat decks. (Enter combat, manuever with gun, shoot, shoot, press, shoot). (Assumes there are guns, though.) >> Rage of Hell > > Note its one or the other and only in ONE combat until your next turn, > for ONE ROUND. Not too strong at all. The +1 strength isn't too bad. It's the obt version. One additional strike is all you need. >>This Meeting Will Adjourn. > > What is so strong about it? I think the inferior and superior need > switched, that's all. Since you're acting, you get first chance to play cards, so you can play it before any tapped vampires other than your own may vote, which is also a flaw IMO (but could be fixed to be: "Tapped vampires abstain", so that you can't have yours vote while no one else's do). But, since the only way to avoid the card is to not tap your titled vampires, and titled vampires tend to be large... In retrospect, it may not be that bad if there's a lot of cheap untap. But then again, it still may be. There was a prophecy like this (tapped vampires can't vote), and it pretty much ensured that whoever called a vote got it through. >>I like how a lot of the nullferiors are conditional, but some of the >>more basic ones probably shouldn't be -- eg, a rush card, etc. > > We haven't gotton to all the cards yet. I know. Just making a statement. >>Inner Focus: Why first strike? > > So they don't get torped before the untap happens? Ah. Nice. Very good flavor of untap for Fortitude, methinks. > Its things like this that I need. Decks you'd build out of just these > cards. Thanks for the info. Card suggestions yourself? Hah. I've got this killer headache, and I've never been too good on the creative side anywhos. I much prefer critiquing other people's efforts. =P --Colin McGuigan

Colin McGuigan wrote: > vermillian wrote: > >>>>> Bullet Dodger >>>>> Combat >>>>> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card >>>>> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during >>>>> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional >>>>> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional >>>>> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. >>>> > I can play this (same > copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... [ quoted text not captured ]

On Fri, 02 Jul 2004 09:20:45 -0500, Colin McGuigan <magu...@BGONEspeakeasy.net> scrawled: >LSJ wrote: >> Note: Sport Bikes aren't stackable. >> They're vehicles. A minion can have only 1 vehicle. > >Sorry. Typo. I misspelled "Raptor". ...and you misspelled "Razor" as R-O-C-K, too. in the bit that got snipped. :D (9th place in a qualifier with a crappy Rock Cat deck. Maybe i should have played my Razor Bat deck.) salem domain:canberra http://www.geocities.com/salem_christ.geo/vtes.htm (replace "hotmail" with "yahoo" to email)

The Doctor <D...@freemail.nl> wrote in message news:<40E7A893...@freemail.nl>... > Colin McGuigan wrote: > > vermillian wrote: > > > >>>>> Bullet Dodger > >>>>> Combat > >>>>> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this card > >>>>> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during > >>>>> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional > >>>>> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional > >>>>> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at close. > >>>> > > I can play this (same > > copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. > > Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... > > //Doc. Actually, he can. you can only return the card from you r ashheap to your hand ONCE each combat. d.

Nova_Arpad wrote: >>> I can play this (same copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. >> >>Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... > > you can only return the card from your ashheap to > your hand ONCE each combat. That's what I was saying. > Actually, he can. So, how would you play THE SAME COPY of this card every round then? You can only get it once... [ quoted text not captured ]

The Doctor wrote: > Colin McGuigan wrote: > >> vermillian wrote: >> >>>>>> Bullet Dodger >>>>>> Combat >>>>>> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this >>>>>> card >>>>>> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during >>>>>> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional >>>>>> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional >>>>>> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at >>>>>> close. >>>>> >>>>> >> I can play this (same >> copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. > > Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... Ah, "once per combat". I totally missed that. Still a great defensive card. --Colin McGuigan

salem wrote: > ...and you misspelled "Razor" as R-O-C-K, too. in the bit that got > snipped. My mommy says I'm a good speler. --Colin McGuigan

"vermillian" <vermil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:f987c6cd.0407...@posting.google.com... > e...@boursorama.com (Emmanuel Martin) wrote in message news:<10c2c156.04070...@posting.google.com>... > > > Nuetral Form > > > AM > > > Play as the action is anounced. Vis: For the remainder of this action, > > > at the beginning of a round of combat, this acting vampire may burn > > > one blood to make its strikes undodgeable. Aus: For the remainder of > > > this action, reacting vampires may not have more than one intercept. > > > > Pouf, block impossible. Do you really think that is interesting ? > > Yeah, I'm stupid. Suggestions? well, at least your self evaluation is realistic. Maybe stop posting such stuff ? =)

Reyda wrote: > well, at least your self evaluation is realistic. Maybe stop posting such > stuff ? =) Come on. At least this stuff is interesting. --Colin McGuigan

[ quoted text not captured ] Intent is there, yes. But since it can be played again and the second play will give a new "once per combat" option to retrieve it the next round, it can indeed be played every round. You'd need "A vampire can play only 1 BD each combat" (or "can retrieve only 1 BD each combat" or somesuch) in order to get around the fact that playing the card again gets the effect again. [ quoted text not captured ]

The Doctor <D...@freemail.nl> wrote in message news:<40E81FFB...@freemail.nl>... > Nova_Arpad wrote: > >>> I can play this (same copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. > >> > >>Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... > > > > you can only return the card from your ashheap to > > your hand ONCE each combat. > > That's what I was saying. > > > Actually, he can. > > So, how would you play THE SAME COPY of this card every round then? > > You can only get it once... > > //Doc. damn you're right i misread. my bad d.

LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:<qP0Gc.192709$Gx4.1...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>... > Colin McGuigan wrote: > > The Doctor wrote: > >> Colin McGuigan wrote: > >>> vermillian wrote: > >>>>>>> Bullet Dodger > >>>>>>> Combat > >>>>>>> Once per combat, if combat goes for another round beond when this > >>>>>>> card > >>>>>>> was played, you may return it from your ashheap to your hand during > >>>>>>> the next round. Cel: Only at close. Strike: Dodge with an additional > >>>>>>> strike: dodge. This strike does not count against your additional > >>>>>>> strikes allocated for this round. CEL: As above, but useable at > >>>>>>> close. > >>>>>> > >>> I can play this (same > >>> copy of the) card _EVERY ROUND_. > >> > >> Since you can only replace it once per combat, I don't think so... > > > > Ah, "once per combat". I totally missed that. > > Intent is there, yes. Even the intent is a bit rough... slightly on the higher power curve, but then again... So what? You're dodging a bunch. "Playtesting" would prove whether or not this is too strong... > But since it can be played again and the second play will give a new > "once per combat" option to retrieve it the next round, it can indeed > be played every round. You'd need "A vampire can play only 1 BD each > combat" (or "can retrieve only 1 BD each combat" or somesuch) in > order to get around the fact that playing the card again gets the > effect again. Yeah, I already knew this was an issue with some of these cards, but I'm relying on intent initially. I'm sure your initial cards are worded perfectly from inception to first playtest draft, now are they? :) And WTF are you doing reading this thread anyhow? Bored? ~SV

vermillian wrote: > Yeah, I already knew this was an issue with some of these cards, but > I'm relying on intent initially. I'm sure your initial cards are > worded perfectly from inception to first playtest draft, now are they? > :) Sorry, I wasn't berating your writing or the effort you've expended. Just clarifying Doc's and Colin's concerns w.r.t. how the actual card text would function (which would factor in to playtesting, actually - playtesters should test card text, not intent :-). [ quoted text not captured ]

LSJ wrote: > vermillian wrote: > >> Yeah, I already knew this was an issue with some of these cards, but >> I'm relying on intent initially. I'm sure your initial cards are >> worded perfectly from inception to first playtest draft, now are they? >> :) > > > Sorry, I wasn't berating your writing or the effort you've expended. > Just clarifying Doc's and Colin's concerns w.r.t. how the actual > card text would function (which would factor in to playtesting, > actually - playtesters should test card text, not intent :-). > I was actually trying to focus on intent at first :) Or at least trying to get to the intent from the words I was reading. I'm very sure many of these cardtexts would need very many rewordings to get the intent into wording that is as little as possible open to other interpretations than the actual intent... Hmm, try reading that without misreading the intent :P [ quoted text not captured ]

LSJ <vte...@white-wolf.com> wrote in message news:<cPjGc.198114$Gx4.1...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>... > vermillian wrote: > > Yeah, I already knew this was an issue with some of these cards, but > > I'm relying on intent initially. I'm sure your initial cards are > > worded perfectly from inception to first playtest draft, now are they? > > :) > > Sorry, I wasn't berating your writing or the effort you've expended. > Just clarifying Doc's and Colin's concerns w.r.t. how the actual > card text would function (which would factor in to playtesting, > actually - playtesters should test card text, not intent :-). Yeah, writing for logical progession to accomplish one's intent blows when designing these things. Its only after first thinking of the card concept that you start worrying about the specific mechanics of perfecting the logical conclusion of ones intent. Isn't that the case with your process? Card concept is pretty much all I'm after right now, with people giving me more card concepts, arguments why certain card concepts wouldn't be good for a draftable base set, discussions of the bigger picture, etc... Which so far I've had like, two people, assisting me partially in a limited many on some of those areas... Ho hum, I'm having a good time, none-the-less. ~SV

"Reyda" <true_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<40e88239$0$28561$79c1...@nan-newsreader-06.noos.net>... [ quoted text not captured ] By 'such stuff' do you mean simplified self evaluations of the type that I did, unbalanced fanset cards, or fanset cards altogether? There are appropriate resonponses to the first two, if confirmed, but the last I feel is probably your intent (there's that word again...), so I'll respond as if assuming that's the case. You're just not dork enough to take on this task, are you? ~SV

Colin McGuigan <magu...@BGONEspeakeasy.net> wrote in message news:<2e6dnbTl6r6...@speakeasy.net>... > vermillian wrote: > > But it needs to be "the best at intercept" doesn't it? > > Yep. Picky, aren't I? =P > > >> Monster from the Woods > > > > Should have been listed as 2 pool with 2 life. On par with allies > > being created now a days. > > 2 pool is more reasonable, yeah. Still kinda powerful. Give it a gun > and it walks all over non-combat decks. (Enter combat, manuever with > gun, shoot, shoot, press, shoot). (Assumes there are guns, though.) > > >> Rage of Hell > > > > Note its one or the other and only in ONE combat until your next turn, > > for ONE ROUND. Not too strong at all. > > The +1 strength isn't too bad. It's the obt version. One additional > strike is all you need. > > >>This Meeting Will Adjourn. > > > > What is so strong about it? I think the inferior and superior need > > switched, that's all. > > Since you're acting, you get first chance to play cards, so you can play > it before any tapped vampires other than your own may vote, I'm not actually incredibly sure about this... Can people vote in there prior to your playing of cards. The rule book mentions the acting minion gets to toss in a bunch of cards (or does it say effects?) prior to all other methuselah, but does that count for tossing in votes? > which is > also a flaw IMO One effect, clockwise from the acting methuselah, would probably be better, in some cases, but time consuming and in other cases, it wouldn't be ("sudection, anyone? Tears of the crocodile..." "Um... its no longer 'as the action was announced' so..." "Oh, go to hell!") > (but could be fixed to be: "Tapped vampires abstain", so > that you can't have yours vote while no one else's do). So the acting vampire doesn't vote either (assuming its tapped)? Weird... But alright. > But, since the > only way to avoid the card is to not tap your titled vampires, and > titled vampires tend to be large... Yeah, and you really wouldn't know if other people are going to be packing these. How about the "No additional action modifiers may be played this action" addition? No, actually, that wouldn't work either, would it, as you could just play your BO and Awe first, then this card... you couldn't voter cap though could you? How about "Tapped vampires must abstain unless they burn one blood". That's simple enough, weakens the card considerably, but as you mentioned it was so strong... Good? > In retrospect, it may not be that bad if there's a lot of cheap untap. > But then again, it still may be. There was a prophecy like this (tapped > vampires can't vote), and it pretty much ensured that whoever called a > vote got it through. Who knows, but probably none useable during a PA... although that'd be interesting... Eternal Lobbying!: Reaction: Requires a titled vampire. Only useable during a Referendum other than a blood hunt. This vampire untaps and gains one vote in the referendum. Wacky... quite cornercase and probably doesn't belong in a base draft set... But who knows. I'm sure 10% of the cards could probably be of marginal cornercase-esque use and not hurt things too much... > >>I like how a lot of the nullferiors are conditional, but some of the > >>more basic ones probably shouldn't be -- eg, a rush card, etc. > > > > We haven't gotton to all the cards yet. > > I know. Just making a statement. Thank you for it regardless. Don't let my bad mood interfere with your comments. > >>Inner Focus: Why first strike? > > > > So they don't get torped before the untap happens? > > Ah. Nice. Very good flavor of untap for Fortitude, methinks. Too weak, or about right (power wise)? > > Its things like this that I need. Decks you'd build out of just these > > cards. Thanks for the info. Card suggestions yourself? > > Hah. I've got this killer headache, and I've never been too good on the > creative side anywhos. I much prefer critiquing other people's efforts. =P So be it. I need critics, and people to assist, like you did, in telling me how they'd combine with all the other stuff.

vermillian wrote: > I'm not actually incredibly sure about this... Can people vote in > there prior to your playing of cards. The rule book mentions the > acting minion gets to toss in a bunch of cards (or does it say > effects?) prior to all other methuselah, but does that count for > tossing in votes? Well, I remember asking LSJ about this before, and if I remember his answer correctly, votes aren't restricted by 1.6.1.6 (ie, you don't have to go around clockwise, and if it goes around with no one voting, the acting meth isn't restricted from voting then anyways), but, on the other hand, if you have an instance where multiple people want to do things, 1.6.1.6 is used to resolve who gets to do what first. > So the acting vampire doesn't vote either (assuming its tapped)? > Weird... But alright. <shrugs> Just going along with the card. That was certainly the case with the prophecy, though. > Yeah, and you really wouldn't know if other people are going to be > packing these. How about the "No additional action modifiers may be > played this action" addition? No, actually, that wouldn't work > either, would it, as you could just play your BO and Awe first, then > this card... you couldn't voter cap though could you? Not being able to voter cap (if you had such a card) would be a small price to pay, esp. if you get to toss your +vote cards first. You're pretty much guaranteed to pass any vote, unless anyone with titles never taps. > How about "Tapped vampires must abstain unless they burn one blood". > That's simple enough, weakens the card considerably, but as you > mentioned it was so strong... Good? That could work. pre: Tapped vampires must spend a blood to vote. PRE: Your tapped vampires may vote for free. Comparable in effect to Madrigal, but without the carrot. > Eternal Lobbying!: Reaction: Requires a titled vampire. Only useable > during a Referendum other than a blood hunt. This vampire untaps and > gains one vote in the referendum. > > Wacky... quite cornercase and probably doesn't belong in a base draft > set... But who knows. I'm sure 10% of the cards could probably be of > marginal cornercase-esque use and not hurt things too much... I wouldn't use it. If no one else is playing vote, those are wasted cards. And of course you can't use it in your own turn (which is good). > Too weak, or about right (power wise)? [Inner Focus] Probably a little bit too weak compared to, eg, the Celerity one. Requires a combat, so if you don't get blocked, no untap for you. Also, means you have to take one on the chin. Maybe the inf is untap during combat, and the sup is untap as an action modifier? --Colin McGuigan