Quick one: If Shemti is ready and untapped and you are bled by another
vampire for 1, which Shemti reduces to 0 with superior Ecstasy, who
gets to order the effects? I'm assuming the acting methuselah can.
Assuming a vamp with 1 blood, he can either take the damage before
uselessly burning a blood, or he can burn the blood first if, say,
you've got his vamp in Temptation-lock and he wants it in torpor. Of
course, in the latter case, you can always play Ecstasy at inferior
instead.
Related question: Instead of Shemti, we have Ecstasy and Crocodile
Temple. In this case, I believe you can wait until after Ecstasy's
burn blood is applied before tapping the Crocodile Temple, since both
happen in the same window. (actually, since Croc is "at the end" of
an action, maybe you have no choice and *have* to wait until after
Ecstasy is resolved?)
Unrelated, but just checking: Scarce only causes you to pay extra pool
if a vamp is brought out during your *influence* phase, correct?
relevant card text:
Shemti, 9, vic OBF POT PRE SER, Followers of Set, 5, [LotN]
Independent: Shemti has1 vote (titled). While he is ready and
untapped, any minion successfully performing a (D) action against you
takes 1 damage (after resolving theaction).
Ecstasy, Reaction, Serpentis, C2 , [FN:C2/PS2]
[ser] Reduce a bleed against you by 1. [SER] As above, and if the
bleed resolves for 0 (or less), the acting minion burns 1 blood or
life (after resolving the action).
Crocodile Temple, The, Master, Followers of Set, R , [KMW]
Master: unique location. You may tap this card at the end of a
successful (D) action against you to inflict 1 damage on the acting
minion (after resolving the action).
Chris Berger wrote:
[ quoted text not captured ]
Both Shemti, and the Crocodile Temple require a successful (D) action.
A bleed for 1, reduced to 0 with ecstasy is no longer a successful
action, so neither effect kicks in. The acting minion would take 1
damage from the ecstasy, but Shemti and the Temple's effects do not
trigger, since at action resolution (after ecstasy has been played)
the action is unsuccessful.
Chris Berger wrote:
> Quick one: If Shemti is ready and untapped and you are bled by another
> vampire for 1, which Shemti reduces to 0 with superior Ecstasy, who
> gets to order the effects? I'm assuming the acting methuselah can.
Yes.
> Assuming a vamp with 1 blood, he can either take the damage before
> uselessly burning a blood, or he can burn the blood first if, say,
> you've got his vamp in Temptation-lock and he wants it in torpor. Of
> course, in the latter case, you can always play Ecstasy at inferior
> instead.
Sure.
> Related question: Instead of Shemti, we have Ecstasy and Crocodile
> Temple. In this case, I believe you can wait until after Ecstasy's
> burn blood is applied before tapping the Crocodile Temple, since both
> happen in the same window. (actually, since Croc is "at the end" of
> an action, maybe you have no choice and *have* to wait until after
> Ecstasy is resolved?)
Effectively, you *must* wait. The acting Methuselah cannot pass (instead of
applying the mandatory Ecstasy effect) in order for you to be able to tap the
Temple first.
> Unrelated, but just checking: Scarce only causes you to pay extra pool
> if a vamp is brought out during your *influence* phase, correct?
Yes.
relevant rules text:
Scarce: When a Methuselah moves a scarce vampire from her uncontrolled region to
her ready region during her influence phase, she must burn 3 pool for every
other vampire of the same clan already in play.
[ quoted text not captured ]
tbz_...@hotmail.com wrote:
> Both Shemti, and the Crocodile Temple require a successful (D) action.
> A bleed for 1, reduced to 0 with ecstasy is no longer a successful
> action,
An action that reaches resolution unblocked is successful (unless it fizzles due
to the lack of valid target or lack of cost-paying ability).
The bleed may not be successful (0), but the action is.
Chris Berger <ark...@ugcs.caltech.edu> wrote in news:48459044-95de-4985-
a328-efc...@c4g2000hsg.googlegroups.com:
>
> Quick one: If Shemti is ready and untapped and you are bled by another
> vampire for 1, which Shemti reduces to 0 with superior Ecstasy, who
> gets to order the effects? I'm assuming the acting methuselah can.
Yes, when a target has multiple simultaneous effects to resolve, the
target's controller decides the order of resolution.
> Assuming a vamp with 1 blood, he can either take the damage before
> uselessly burning a blood, or he can burn the blood first if, say,
> you've got his vamp in Temptation-lock and he wants it in torpor. Of
> course, in the latter case, you can always play Ecstasy at inferior
> instead.
>
> Related question: Instead of Shemti, we have Ecstasy and Crocodile
> Temple. In this case, I believe you can wait until after Ecstasy's
> burn blood is applied before tapping the Crocodile Temple, since both
> happen in the same window. (actually, since Croc is "at the end" of
> an action, maybe you have no choice and *have* to wait until after
> Ecstasy is resolved?)
>
I'd agree. The "tap to" portion of Croc Temple puts the timing control
back into the hands of the controller of Croc Temple, and there is an
opportunity to tap it after the Ecstasy is resolved.
> Unrelated, but just checking: Scarce only causes you to pay extra pool
> if a vamp is brought out during your *influence* phase, correct?
>
Yes, the rulebook is explicit in stating this from;
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/rulebook/rulebook.html#sec11
"Scarce: When a Methuselah moves a scarce vampire from her uncontrolled
region to her ready region during her influence phase, she must burn 3
pool for every other vampire of the same clan already in play. "
DaveZ
Atom Weaver
On 31 Jan, 14:28, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
[ quoted text not captured ]
Really? Thats interesting, I'd always assumed that since the action
was bleed, and the bleed was unsuccessful, the action was unsuccessful.
On 31 Jan, 14:28, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote:
[ quoted text not captured ]
For clarification then - a bleed bounced and not blocked by the new
target meth is a successful bleed - is it a successful action? Is the
lack of block the condition, or is it that the target has changed, so
the action is unsuccessful as declared?
[ quoted text not captured ]
Yeah, that's a problem with the dual use of "bleed".
Compare to "political action" and "referendum".
The action is "bleed action" the resolution package is "bleed".
referendums and bleeds may be unsuccessful even if their respective actions
(political actions and bleed actions) succeed.
tbz_...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On 31 Jan, 14:28, LSJ <vtes...@white-wolf.com> wrote:>> tbz_be...@hotmail.com wrote:>>> Both Shemti, and the Crocodile Temple require a successful (D) action.
>>> A bleed for 1, reduced to 0 with ecstasy is no longer a successful
>>> action,>> An action that reaches resolution unblocked is successful (unless it fizzles due
>> to the lack of valid target or lack of cost-paying ability).
>>
>> The bleed may not be successful (0), but the action is.>
> For clarification then - a bleed bounced and not blocked by the new
> target meth is a successful bleed - is it a successful action?
Yes. It reached resolution unblocked.
> Is the
> lack of block the condition, or is it that the target has changed, so
> the action is unsuccessful as declared?
It succeeds, with a valid target.
[ quoted text not captured ]
Yeah, it is a little bit confusing, but trust me, it's better this
way. Otherwise you have weirdness like Freak Drive being unplayable
on a bleed that resolves for 0 (because inferior can only be used on a
successful action, and superior can only be used when blocked).
Although... there are some other cards now which cause an action to
just fail and also disallow Freak Drive completely - it seems a little
strange, and maybe Freak Drive should be reworded to "As above, but
playable on an unsuccessful action (play after combat, if any)." But
as it currently stands, Army of Apparitions (sup), for example, will
keep the acting minion from Freak Driving.
> as it currently stands, Army of Apparitions (sup), for example, will
> keep the acting minion from Freak Driving.
And on the other side of the fence, so does Kiss of Ra.
--
-bur
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Chris Berger a écrit :
[ quoted text not captured ]
I think freak drive is good as it is worded now.
It's good to be able to tone down thos multi action freaks with
obediende or army of apparitions.
On Feb 2, 8:25 am, reyda <true_re...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I think freak drive is good as it is worded now.
> It's good to be able to tone down thos multi action freaks with
> obediende or army of apparitions.
>
Well, maybe. But it's still weird, and counter-intuitive, at least at
first.