multiple copies

i'm sure these questions have all been answered before, but i didn't get to see them... i assume a vampire Can have multiple copies of the same equipment (as long as it's not unique), but can it then use them all? e.g. a vampire with 2 bastard swords & 2 flak jackets: are each of its hand strikes at +2 damage? and can it prevent up to 2 damage each combat? i could visualize this as the vampire having a sword in each hand & one jacket over the other, but for more than 2 it gets a bit silly. i can't find any rules in the v:tes book about this (maybe i haven't looked hard enough, but i don't think so). i know that you can't use, say, 2 .44 magnums, unless you have 2 strikes, but things like the bastard sword seem to be just "permanent" (all due respect to the points in the "equipment is not worth it" stringbase) modifiers. it looks to me like a vampire with a bastard sword does strike: hand damage, with +1 hand damage, not strike: use melee weapon, as if it were the latter, i would have expected wording closer to that. nor does the flak jacket card say that a minion may only have 1 at a time. please tell me if there are rules/rulings i have missed about this. also, by the same interpretation, could a minion have a bastard sword & a wooden stake, giving base hand damage of 1 normal + 1 aggravated? can a minion elect NOT to use the stake, if doing a hand strike? on a similar note, can multiple copies of Brujah debate, and Carthage remembered (non-unique masters) be used, giving cumulative effects (i.e. x manouvers & +x hand damage to all Brujah, & +x stealth for all Brujah Princes & Justicars when bleeding, respectively)? if so, is it still only the SINGLE oldest Brujah each Metheusalah controls tapped? i can't remember if guardian angel is unique, but if it is, can a vampire have multiple copies, with cumulative effects? oh, and i've changed my mind about which version of the aggravated damage rules is best; i now think the 7/7 ruling makes for better games. RE: best vampire, i think Thetmes is fairly unstoppable: CEL, QUI, OBF & agg hand damage. 2 votes as well. Basilia too, for agg hand damage, as well as FOR, ANI, PRO. and Watenda is an extremely effective blocker, given a gun, esp deer rifle, and a sport bike, and a few aus skill cards. but there are some crap vampires: who wants to give Heather Florent (or whoever has that ability) the blood from the edge?

b...@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Ben O\'Leary) wrote: > > i'm sure these questions have all been answered before, but i didn't get to see > them... > > i assume a vampire Can have multiple copies of the same equipment (as long as it's > not unique), yes. > but can it then use them all? Sure. > e.g. a vampire with 2 bastard swords & 2 > flak jackets: are each of its hand strikes at +2 damage? Either of the Bastard Swords can be used as a strike. But the strike is either: strike with Sword A or strike with Sword B (or some other strike that doesn't involve the swords, like a hand strike). > and can it prevent up to 2 > damage each combat? Yes. >i could visualize this as the vampire having a sword in each hand > & one jacket over the other, but for more than 2 it gets a bit silly. i can't find > any rules in the v:tes book about this (maybe i haven't looked hard enough, but i > don't think so). i know that you can't use, say, 2 .44 magnums, unless you have 2 > strikes, but things like the bastard sword seem to be just "permanent" (all due > respect to the points in the "equipment is not worth it" stringbase) modifiers. it > looks to me like a vampire with a bastard sword does strike: hand damage, with +1 > hand damage, not strike: use melee weapon, as if it were the latter, i would have > expected wording closer to that. Yes, the wording is poor. Treat it as the latter ("Using this weapon to strike does strength+1 damage"). >nor does the flak jacket card say that a minion may > only have 1 at a time. please tell me if there are rules/rulings i have missed about > this. also, by the same interpretation, could a minion have a bastard sword & a > wooden stake, giving base hand damage of 1 normal + 1 aggravated? can a minion elect > NOT to use the stake, if doing a hand strike? The minion can strike with the Sword (for strength+1), with the Stake, or with hands. Not a combination. > on a similar note, can multiple copies of Brujah debate, and Carthage remembered > (non-unique masters) be used, giving cumulative effects (i.e. x manouvers & +x hand > damage to all Brujah, & +x stealth for all Brujah Princes & Justicars when bleeding, > respectively)? if so, is it still only the SINGLE oldest Brujah each Metheusalah > controls tapped? Yes. > i can't remember if guardian angel is unique, but if it is, can a vampire have > multiple copies, with cumulative effects? Yes. > oh, and i've changed my mind about which version of the aggravated damage rules is > best; i now think the 7/7 ruling makes for better games. Good to hear. :-) -- L. Scott Johnson (vte...@wizards.com) VTES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast. Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and DCI (tournament) rules: http://www.wizards.com/VTES/VTES_Rules.html -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own

In article <731pns$qk7$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, LSJ <vte...@wizards.com> wrote: >b...@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Ben O\'Leary) wrote: >>i can't remember if guardian angel is unique, but if it is, can a vampire have >>multiple copies, with cumulative effects? > >Yes. OK, now I'm confused. A vampire can have multiple copies of a unique card attached!? Is that what you meant to say LSJ? -- /\ Jasper Phillips /VVVVVVVVVVVVVV|~"~"~"~"~"~"----------........____ jaz j^^^^^^^^^^^^^\/"~"~"~"~-----------........._____ ~"~--. * http://www.engr.orst.edu/~philljas/ "~"~'--`

Minor gripe... can you post with a more sensible line length next time, say around 60 or so? You can see how it munges up for newsreaders. In article <F2oA68.J05.0.sta...@dcs.ed.ac.uk>, Ben O'Leary <b...@dcs.ed.ac.uk> writes > >i assume a vampire Can have multiple copies of the same equipment (as long as >it's >not unique), Also, some equipment has explicit statement to that effect. eg Laptop Computer. There may be others. >but can it then use them all? This varies from card to card. >e.g. a vampire with 2 bastard swords >& 2 >flak jackets: are each of its hand strikes at +2 damage? No. You pick one piece of equipment for a strike, not total them all up. >and can it prevent up >to 2 >damage each combat? Yes, it could. The two flak jackets are cumulative. >i could visualize this as the vampire having a sword in each >hand >& one jacket over the other, but for more than 2 it gets a bit silly. i can't >find >any rules in the v:tes book about this (maybe i haven't looked hard enough, but >i >don't think so). Page 47. "Then the blocking minion decides what his strike will be: *an* assault with *an* equipment card" > i know that you can't use, say, 2 .44 magnums, unless you have >2 >strikes, You don't need two. Shoot with the first one first strike, and the same one on the second strike. >but things like the bastard sword seem to be just "permanent" (all due >respect to the points in the "equipment is not worth it" stringbase) modifiers. >it >looks to me like a vampire with a bastard sword does strike: hand damage, with >+1 >hand damage, This is incorrect. A vampire chooses a piece of equipment to strike with. A melee weapon then deals melee weapon damage as a melee weapon strike, so it gets hosed by Immortal Grapple. >not strike: use melee weapon, as if it were the latter, i would >have >expected wording closer to that. This is an example of sloppy wording on the cards. >nor does the flak jacket card say that a minion >may >only have 1 at a time. No, you can have loads. Michelin Man Democritus was my favourite (about 3 of the things). >please tell me if there are rules/rulings i have missed >about >this. also, by the same interpretation, could a minion have a bastard sword & a >wooden stake, giving base hand damage of 1 normal + 1 aggravated? No. You pick one or the other. You don't strike with the stake and sword at once. > can a minion >elect >NOT to use the stake, if doing a hand strike? Of course. You don't have to use optional equipment. > >on a similar note, can multiple copies of Brujah debate, and Carthage remembered >(non-unique masters) be used, giving cumulative effects (i.e. x manouvers & +x >hand >damage to all Brujah, & +x stealth for all Brujah Princes & Justicars when >bleeding, >respectively)? I believe so, in both cases. >if so, is it still only the SINGLE oldest Brujah each Metheusalah >controls tapped? I think so. However, multiple Brujah Debates are fragile anyway. >i can't remember if guardian angel is unique, but if it is, can a vampire have >multiple copies, with cumulative effects? If it isn't unique then yes, they can. And it isn't unique. In V:TES, almost everything is cumulative unless it SETS a value rather than adds to a value. Even if it sets a value, the rest can add on top of it. > >oh, and i've changed my mind about which version of the aggravated damage rules >is >best; i now think the 7/7 ruling makes for better games. Agreed. It stops random burning, though it is more complicated. > >RE: best vampire, i think Thetmes is fairly unstoppable: CEL, QUI, OBF & agg >hand >damage. 2 votes as well. Basilia too, for agg hand damage, as well as FOR, ANI, >PRO. I like both, but they are both very expensive in my opinion. You need good, clever blood management. >and Watenda is an extremely effective blocker, given a gun, esp deer rifle, and >a >sport bike, Yeah, he's nice with his ability to cancel cards ;) >and a few aus skill cards. >but there are some crap vampires: who wants to give Heather Florent (or whoever >has >that ability) the blood from the edge? It could be useful, especially if you are playing expensive cards. She doesn't pay heavily for it anyway - only losing a point of disciplines. -- James Coupe (Prince of Mercia, England) Vampire: Elder Kindred Network http://madnessnetwork.hexagon.net

James Coupe wrote: >> i know that you can't use, say, 2 .44 magnums, unless you have >>2 strikes, > > You don't need two. Shoot with the first one first strike, and the same > one on the second strike. The only way I can see having multiple copies guns one one vampire is if they were playing with Ghoul Retainer or Dragon Breath Rounds. Other than that, I just don't see the point. Noal -- "DISCUSSION, n. A method of confirming others in their errors." -Ambrose Bierce. [ quoted text not captured ]

Jasper Phillips wrote: > In article <731pns$qk7$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, LSJ <vte...@wizards.com> wrote: > >b...@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Ben O\'Leary) wrote: > >>i can't remember if guardian angel is unique, but if it is, can a vampire have > >>multiple copies, with cumulative effects? > > > >Yes. > > OK, now I'm confused. A vampire can have multiple copies of a unique > card attached!? Is that what you meant to say LSJ? > > -- That was the evil JSL posing as Scott. Ignore that answer.

In article <7323j9$3s0$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, Dhar...@yahoo.com wrote: >>> i know that you can't use, say, 2 .44 magnums, unless you have >>>2 strikes, >> >> You don't need two. Shoot with the first one first strike, and the same >> one on the second strike. > >The only way I can see having multiple copies guns one one vampire is >if they were playing with Ghoul Retainer or Dragon Breath Rounds. >Other than that, I just don't see the point. Obviously you've never seen a Toreador try to impersonate Bruce Willis in Last Boy Scouts. Just imagine him bring out two zip guns and shoot repeatedly with both. Just forget the extra damage. You have to suffer to have style! Bleu

In article <732oqq$h15$1...@supernews.com>, Philippe Richer <leg...@nospam.generation.net> wrote: > >Obviously you've never seen a Toreador try to impersonate Bruce Willis in Who is, of course, impersonating Chow Yun Fat. Chow Yun Fat is the man when it comes to both guns blazing. [ quoted text not captured ]

[ quoted text not captured ] Sorry - wasn't reading closely enough. Guardian Angel is not unique. You can have multiple copies, with cumulative results. Obviously, you cannot have multiple copies of any unique card out with any result other than: contest those copies. Sorry about that. [ quoted text not captured ]

Jasper Phillips wrote: > > In article <732oqq$h15$1...@supernews.com>, > Philippe Richer <leg...@nospam.generation.net> wrote: > > > >Obviously you've never seen a Toreador try to impersonate Bruce Willis in > > Who is, of course, impersonating Chow Yun Fat. Chow Yun Fat is the man > when it comes to both guns blazing. > Bah! Anyone can be a man when he's got guns. And Chow Yun Fat barely cuts it even then. I'd much prefer to see Jacko impersonate Jet Li. Sword of Judgement, Bastard Sword, Bang Nahk. Use a different one for each strike. I suppose to really top it off, we'd need to give him fortitude, let someone do a 20 damage strike with potence and a melee weapon, then use Undead Persistance... 8) -Chris

In article <36571D52...@cco.caltech.edu>, Chris Berger <ber...@cco.caltech.edu> wrote: >Jasper Phillips wrote: >> >Obviously you've never seen a Toreador try to impersonate Bruce Willis in >> Who is, of course, impersonating Chow Yun Fat. Chow Yun Fat is the man >> when it comes to both guns blazing. >> >Bah! Anyone can be a man when he's got guns. And Chow Yun Fat barely >cuts it even then. > >I'd much prefer to see Jacko impersonate Jet Li. Sword of Judgement, >Bastard Sword, Bang Nahk. Use a different one for each strike. I >suppose to really top it off, we'd need to give him fortitude, let >someone do a 20 damage strike with potence and a melee weapon, then use >Undead Persistance... 8) I have to admit Jet Li's my favorite too. Wish it was easy to find his stuff in this podunk college town. [ quoted text not captured ]

In article <36571D52...@cco.caltech.edu>, Chris Berger <ber...@cco.caltech.edu> wrote: > Jasper Phillips wrote: > > > > In article <732oqq$h15$1...@supernews.com>, > > Philippe Richer <leg...@nospam.generation.net> wrote: > > > > > >Obviously you've never seen a Toreador try to impersonate Bruce Willis in > > > > Who is, of course, impersonating Chow Yun Fat. Chow Yun Fat is the man > > when it comes to both guns blazing. > > > Bah! Anyone can be a man when he's got guns. And Chow Yun Fat barely > cuts it even then. Nahh...Chow Yun Fat most assuredly *is* the man when it comes to guns... > I'd much prefer to see Jacko impersonate Jet Li. Sword of Judgement, > Bastard Sword, Bang Nahk. Use a different one for each strike. I > suppose to really top it off, we'd need to give him fortitude, let > someone do a 20 damage strike with potence and a melee weapon, then use > Undead Persistance... 8) It would be interesting to see a Jet Li impersonation, but you'd probably have to come up with some sort of "Gravity Defiance" card... Unique Master 0 pool The vampire with this card may make bat-shit insane combat maneuvers, allowing him to use any strike at any range, regardless of other restrictions. He may also do 4 damage as a strike, as the environment itself has been known to help this vampire. And you could always have Spunky Little Kid, the equipment Spunky Little Kid Equipment 1 pool Bearer may strike with Spunky Little Kid for 3R damage. Xian "You can just ignore it...and let hand jam sort them out." --Jasper Phillips [ quoted text not captured ]